My 2110 startup didn't go well

[MuzzcoVW]

[MuzzcoVW]

[ORANGECRUSHer]

I installed some stock tubes today. I had to readjust lash by a few thousandths. Not sure if this indicates I gained some ground. I took a compression reading right away and it rose to just over 90. Still not good. Running it nothing had changed.

At this point I'm considering honing the cylinders. I don't know if turning it over by hand while building the engine can ruin your hone. Maybe these were kinda borderline honed to start. I just went with the hone from the factory (A&A).

I also considered maybe just running the piss out of it as it is and cross my fingers the rings wear in. Just doesn't seem right to do with a new build though.

Looks like I'm done this week. I'm out of town this weekend for work. It's gonna kill me until I can get back and work on it. I will see if I can pick up a leak down kit. Maybe I'll just take one of my compression testers and cut the quick connect off and put my compressor hose on it so I can blow some air in the cylinder.
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[ORANGECRUSHer]

Thanks everybody for the suggestions!
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[chrisflstf]

The comp tester fitting has a shraeder valve in it. Cant use that for leak down

[ORANGECRUSHer]

Good point. I'm gonna pick one up, maybe tomorrow and see what happens. If I don't hear any leak, I'm gonna get in it and run it hard for about 20 minutes around the neighborhood and see if the rings just need some time to seat. I haven't driven it yet, just ran it for a matter of minutes to try tuning things.
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Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[ORANGECRUSHer]

This situation reminds me of a sportbike motor I built back in the early 2000's. I had a local speed shop buy do all my machine work and we bored a 750 GSXR out to 907cc. Well, during the process I had taken the rack of carbs apart to clean them and if you know anything about motorcycle carbs they can be a pita getting them balanced. Well it took some time while the engine was first running. The rings never got seated fully and actually caused a piston to fail. When I went back to the machinist he told me I needed to get on it and ring it's neck out as soon as it's started up. That cost me a fresh hone, a set of rings a new head gasket, another set of pistons and some head work. Ugh that sucked.
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Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[nsracing]

You people crack me up -

You got low compression on an entire bank and you mess around w/ pushrod tubes? You are bleeding from your arm and put the bandaid on the ankle?

Likely the culprit = bad valve and/or seat not concentric. A leakdown will def show that. That is why I will never let go my Sioux valve and seat grinder. That is about as good as you are gonna get.

Cutters are fine if you are perfectly concentric. But any wobble during the cut will make one leaky mess requiring a teardown.

As soon is it is together, take a compression test. YOu will know then if anything is awash before you even hook up the rest of the motor. No sense building it all the way thru without checking and you end up w/ this.

A?nd I have never seen a pushrod tubes so hard it pushes on the heads preventing full torquing. And it is stroker - so you will have to stretch it in the first place.

[chrisflstf]

For ring break in, you need to do it right away, after cam/lifter break in is done. Sometimes, that may not be possible though. The cylinders can get glazed in a little as 30 minutes of idle running. If that is the case, you may never seat the rings fully. A lot of little problems can cause a delay like that – carb adjust, leaks, timing, etc.

[74 Thing]

What rings are you using?

Grant cast iron break in easier than the chrome rings.

[ORANGECRUSHer]

[74 Thing]

I thought that AA came with a chrome ring and you have to order the Grant cast iron rings separately.

[ORANGECRUSHer]

Not unless they make black chrome rings. I may be wrong, this is my first go 'round. But all my rings were black from what I remember.
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[nsracing]

You will glaze the rings if you do not have proper end-gaps for the size piston you are using. Not adequate end-gaps will cook them rings and gall the cylinder walls. Add to that if you run too rich a mixture -most def. will cook the rings from fuel wash. There won't be much oil left on the walls to lube the rings.

Many will risk just sticking a piston in their barrels when they buy them. With every build, you need to take the rings out and re-check to make sure they have proper end-gaps. Even the factory can screw things up once in a while. Your job is to hunt for the one out-of-specs.

STick to the factory manual and you will be fine - is all I am trying to convey.

..and the bitch-slap is the perk of the threads.

[ORANGECRUSHer]

I got it.
end gaps is easy though
it's the next layer that gets me
those little things that you notice if you've done it a few times
those are the things I kinda obsessed over building this

When I torqued the heads the first time with the new SS pushrod tubes I didn't believe that they would hold it back. One look at the gap under the head made me wonder though. I un-torqued and torqued it a few times over until I felt more confident about it. I'm still not sold that was a problem. WHen I looked at the chambers after running it there was the expected film of soot in the chamber from crappy ignition, but I didn't see any evidence of a area where it was escaping over the cylinder wall. On the contrary, I saw the imprint of the cylinder all the way around. So the jury is still out.

We'll get her fingered out
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc

[MuzzcoVW]

[Dan_Lockwood]

Brian, are these the infamous push rod tubes you've been struggling with? These appear to be stainless steel and they are clean through, no web, just round through and through.

They measure 7-5/8" from the end of the straight tube on both ends of the convolutes.

I'm looking up on the web and found EMPI "windage" style that look exactly like these. Mine have nothing inside and only now guessing that the convolutes are the "windage" vanes.

Which end goes where, long end into the head or the block.

Are these good to use, or do the spring loaded ones?

Thanks, Dan

[67rustavenger]

Dan, the long end goes block side.
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

[Dan_Lockwood]

[ORANGECRUSHer]

These are the tubes. Notice they only shrink on one end. Being SS they are ridiculously stiff. There is no stretching them out by hand even if you wanted to. They worked fine on my other head. I think they will work in a narrow range.

I'm not going to argue with people about whether they can throw off torqueing heads unless they can show me they've used them. Plus I don't think it helps me figure out what to do next. Regardless of what I think, I need a leak down test to come to a conclusion. Won't get to it till next week.
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja 1835cc