1776 Engle 110 dual 40idf's distributor choice

[Cschenkel]

Hi Ya'll, I usually lurk over on the type 3 side of things and am newer to non stock engines.

I just had an engine built for my Squareback and am currently using the stock distributor as a place holder. It is a FI distributor SVDA type for type 3's. per the distributor info chart this distributor needs 200mm Hg to get max advance on the vacuum side of things. today I stuck a vacuum gauge on the engine to see what I'm getting as I was suspect that it was not enough

Here's what I got, at Idle I get a whopping 0
T'd vacuum I get roughly 100mm hg
1/2 side gives roughly 120mm hg
3/4 side gives roughly 80-90mm hg

So my question is should I even continue on the path of running a SVDA which seems to be the consensus of best running/best fuel economy or just go with a mechanical advance distributor and cap of the vacuum all together?

I do dream of crank trigger and running microsquirt for ignition but that's currently not in the budget. I'm looking for a solution that wont hurt the bank, and give decent reliability and I'm not afraid of adjusting points.

last question before I rattle on for too long here. With the current distributor I have should I even worry about not getting enough vacuum/ am I just not getting full advance?

Thanks in advance for all of your collective wisdom

[oprn]

First off, you are head and shoulders above most here because you are actually MEASURING your vacuum and THINKING about it!

This is a common problem. We change cams and put multiple carbs on our engines to make it easier for the engine to breath which... wait for it... lowers the vacuum. If it did not then we have not gained any power! So now we have to match the new vacuum signal with an appropriate vacuum pot on the distributor.

Sure, just put an 009 on it set the idle mix fat and go. That is the easy way out and has worked for years especially for those who's driving style is two position, on or off the throttle. However, for the more refined driver that enjoys a smooth and responsive part throttle and for a bit better fuel economy there is an advantage to vacuum advance at part throttle. If there wasn't then there is a whole bunch of auto manufactures out there that wasted a whole lot of money for decades!

I too faced this conundrum when I changed cams and went dual Webers on my engine. My first solution was to open up the vacuum can on the distributor, put a lighter spring in it and make the spring tension adjustable. It showed a lot of promise and I am confident with more time it will work but... I was working long hours at the time and needed to get the car on the road for summer. Plus I was working with a Pertronices III distributor that had already failed once and I did not have much confidence in it. The pot conversion can be see near the end of this thread. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=711733&highlight=

Someone here offered to sell me a used micro jolt crank trigger system for a very reasonable dollar and that ended my experiment. So much easier to do.

Some guys claim to have had good luck with an early VW 1200 adjustable pot distributor, off a 36 HP engine I think. That may be worth a try if you can find one.

Oh, and, you need to investigate the difference in vacuum you are seeing. It has to have a cause. Intake vacuum leak, uneven cylinder compression, carbs and linkage not balance throughout the throttle range... something is off.
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[boxer74]

Consider a 123 Ignition Tune+.

https://123ignition.com/product/tuneplus-4-r-v-v/

Allows you to take advantage of vacuum advance by pulling vacuum from your manifold.
_________________
74 Super
84 Westy

[oprn]

I have heard that those are good! I don't know how they are priced though.
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[boxer74]

[oprn]

I have less than that into my crank trigger system but then I got lucky on it.
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age)

[Lingwendil]

for $700 bucks I'd rather do a Microsquirt, coilpack, and crank trigger
_________________
73 super beetle thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649622 Back on the Road!

Modify your Kadrons for SVDA http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8115884#8115884

Cast iron VJU4BR8 SVDA reference thread- https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0

Need replacement filters for original Kadron aircleaners? WIX #42087 is a perfect fit, as is Napa Gold #2087!

[boxer74]

At this point in my life, time is very much money. The 123 is plug and play for a noticeable improvement over a mechanical advance distributor.

I agree crank trigger is superior, but I'd need to acquire all the bits, learn about it, tinker with it, dial it in, etc. At my charge out rate for my time, I'd be well over $700 into the exercise.

Maybe on my T4 build in the future, I'll look into crank trigger.
_________________
74 Super
84 Westy

[Alstrup]

Its the currewncy that kills the deal somewhat.
A Microsquirt also ads up, because it needs a separate electronic map Map. But correct. It gives you further options. The "problem" is that 80% of the hobby people have more than enough trouble understanding the 123 which runs 2D. Adding the 3rd dimension and most throw in the towel. I learned that the hard way.
_________________
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993

[boxer74]

[Lingwendil]

I like the idea of crank trigger a ton, but the form factor of a real distributor without having to run any form of ignition table or management is just too easy.

I have a Daytona TCS-1 ignition controller that simply needs a locked out distributor to function, I've had it for a few years and still have yet to actually set it up and use it. It has a pretty nice tunable setup and even lets you use a GM MAP sensor for a 3D table.

But my busy/lazy ass still runs a $30 self-restored cast iron distributor with a vacuum pot on it
_________________
73 super beetle thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649622 Back on the Road!

Modify your Kadrons for SVDA http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8115884#8115884

Cast iron VJU4BR8 SVDA reference thread- https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0

Need replacement filters for original Kadron aircleaners? WIX #42087 is a perfect fit, as is Napa Gold #2087!

[boxer74]

[Alstrup]

Getting back to the vacum issue. The IDF carbs are notoriusly poor with vacum signal, To the point of almost non existant some times. They -can- be made to work, but it is not for the faint hearted. This is the second reason why I recommend something else than a SVDA on such engines. The 123 BT is relatively simple, and it is easier for "us" to help you dial it in and trouble shoot since we can basicly just hook up to your phone and see it real time or see a video of a run.
_________________
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993

[boxer74]

[Alstrup]

With almost all dual carbed engines I set them up to 10 degrees @ idle and go from there.
_________________
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993

[boxer74]

[Cschenkel]

[clockworkbox]

I have been trying to figure this out as well. Based on the information I have, it seems like the Bosch 010 mechanical advance is how I am leaning but interested in what you find out here. I would prefer SVDA...
_________________
'69 Beetle (pieces)
Learning the hard way is still learning...

[Millionmph]

I just got a 123 Tune+, easy to set up, and works good; The vacuum map is adjustable too; It cost a lot yes, but worth every cent as can tune in exactly what I want; Its easy to learn, but you have to understand the concepts of vacuum and mech and how they work together; Once you got that, its really straightforward;

[clockworkbox]