Replace rear stub axle

[Eriebugger]

Hi folks, been a Samba member for awhile with only a few posts. Recently bought a 74 Bay Window from a samba add. I'm trying to get it ready to roll when the snow finally melts here in NW Pennsylvania. I've replaced rear brake cyls, all the flexible rubber brake lines & bled the them. It has nearly new EMPI axle shafts & CV joints but one of the boots was already torn so I replaced that when I noticed the pass side axle nut was loose (cotter pin in). I don't have a big enough torque wrench but I thought I would torque it as much as I can (150#) till I could borrow a larger wrench. Needed to turn the nut a little more to line up for the pin but nut kept turning. Appears that the stub shaft threads are stripped. Any advice here on how to change it? I've tried to search but not had much luck. Found info that early & late buses have different shafts and lots of info on the axle shafts with the CV joints but not much on my problem. Bentley manual(yes I bought one) says I need to remove bearing housing from bus to press it out & then I will have to get a rear end alignment after I get everything back together. Is it possible to just do it while on the bus? Any help would be appreciated. Also suggestions on where to buy a new one. Cipl has one for 95, Bus depot at 389 Big difference. WW has one listed (german) at 175 but out of stock. I'll try to post pics of the bus if I ever figure out how. Not very electronically savy. Thanks.

[aeromech]

First, you don't want NEW parts even IF your threads are stripped. It could be that the aftermarket nut you might be using is the problem. Original German stub axles are very tough. So unless you actually can see damaged threads, I'd suggest first getting a good, USED original nut and see if it torques up.

A great place to locate these original parts is called "The busco". Send an email to: [email protected]

He'll get you fixed up fast with some good, hard German steel parts

Next, as far as I know you should be able to replace the stub axle fairly simply. Remove the outer CV from the stub axle (6 bolts) and let the axle shaft flop down and out of the way. You might want to put a plastic bag around the open CV to keep things tidy.

Then, try smacking the threaded end of the stub axle (with the nut in place) with a heavy hammer and drive it inboard. I'm hoping that the circlip won't prevent it from moving inboard. It might just slide all the way out.

Keep in mind that there's a spacer between the two bearings so when you go to install the new axle you may need to reach in with a screwdriver and center the spacer because it probably fell down some.

Unless I'm wrong you should be good to go but always keep a good, tight, torque on those 46mm axle nuts.
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[airschooled]

EDIT: aeromech beat me to it. That's what I get for falling back asleep halfway through a post…

Hi there! Sorry to hear about your thread problem. Are you sure it's the threads? Like, have you laid eyes on them? The stub axle is pretty damn hard metal, though it could happen.

Yes, 1971-1979 use the same stub axle, and to remove and install stub axles, on any year bus:

1. With car on ground and wheels chocked, break the axle nut free no more than a half turn.

1A. Disconnect the outer CV joint. Some people prefer to do this on the ground, others prefer it with the wheel in the air so it can spin. Order doesn't matter so it's dealer's choice here; just get the outer CV joint off and bag it for cleanliness. No need to remove the inner joint, just tie the axle up out of your way.

2. Safely remove wheel.

3. Remove two 10mm M6 bolts from brake drum. Remove brake drum.

4. Remove cotter pin and axle nut. Remove wheel hub. (You did remember to grease the splines when you installed the brake drum, right?)

5. CLEAN the exposed stub axle because it will pass through your wheel bearings. Remember that VW got lazy with their maintenance intervals and your rear wheel bearings are supposed to last Forever. No grit allowed.

5a. Reinstall axle nut upside down and flush with end of axle to protect threads from errant hammer blows.

6. Take a hammer and drift (punch) that fits into the recess on the end of the stub axle and give it one medium whack, straight on. Listen to the sound. Get ear protection if you're a musician.

7. Tap a thousand light taps if you must, and the stub axle will slowly creep out. It is impossible to damage anything with a thousand light taps, but one overzealous whack can really put a damper on your day. Once the upside down axle nut reaches the seal, remove it and push the axle out by hand. Maybe a few dozen more light taps if the local squirrel population is having a bad day.


Installation is roughly the reverse of removal. Grease on the axle splines before and after installation, and a thousand more light taps!

Achtung! Listen for the sound of the axle again, seriously this time! When the "song" of the axle reverb changes, the axle is fully seated. You'l know it if you're paying good attention in a quiet workplace with no distractions.

Get some anti-sieze or grease where the drum mounts on the hub, and then anti-seize the small drum bolts, the big stub axle threads and the lug nut threads.

Get your 253 ft*lbs. on the cheater bar like this. If you weigh X lbs., then you stand Y inches down the pipe. No bouncing on the pipe, just a nice smooth one-footed glide down. (Assuming you cleaned and lubricated as noted…) You will need the wheels chocked, and a helper holding the foot brakes helps as well.

X.lbs......Y."
250.......12.5
175.......18
125.......25

Other body weights can extrapolate…

Once arrived at the requisite torque, you must advance the nut to the next immediate cotter pin hole, no further! All of this must be done off the ground, so you don't load up the axle nut with skewed torque from the road wheel.

Once installed, get the job wrapped up, and loosely install the cotter pin. You will be back in about a hundred miles to check the axle nut torque, then you may install the cotter pin For Real. Check the longest for proper torque at this time as well.

I like to install the nut so that the cotter pin holes are perfectly lined up and the cotter pin can just slip right in. Then I'll bend the pin so that it can never fall out but can still wiggle in the bore. Then my "quick check" of my nut torque is to wiggle the cotter pin whenever I have the hub cap off. Wiggles? That means the nut hasn't moved. Cotter pin doesn't wiggle? The nut has moved; time to investigate.

Good luck, let me know if you have any questions!
Robbie
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[SGKent]

150 ft lbs doesn't cut it. It is 253 minimum. Measure 12" out from the socket center on a breaker bar. Measure what you weigh. when you stand on the bar with it parallel to the ground 12" out you are putting whatever your weight is as foot pounds on the breaker bar. If you weigh 250 then standing 12" out will torque the nut to 250 ft lbs. 253 divided by your weigh X 12" will tell you about how many inches to stand out. If you weigh 180 then stand about 16" or 17" out. Grab the rain gutter with some gloves on when you do this in case the socket comes off. Then if the cotter pin won't align keep tightening the nut to the next slot just exposes the cotter pin hole. I do the final tightening with the wheels on the ground.
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[Eriebugger]

Thanks everybody. Neither the threads in the nut or on the axle really look terrible but the nut just turns and doesn't tighten up. I did try turn turning the nut around and it did tighten up. Didn't torque it but it did grab so I think I will try getting another nut and see if it will torque up before I go knocking out the axle. Thanks again, I have a feeling I'll be back with lots more questions.

[airschooled]

Good to know you might be off easy. It's better for me to type a long useless post than for posts to go unanswered!

But seriously, there's a possibility that the stub axle just wasn't seated all the way, and tightening the nut finished "drawing it in."

Hopefully that was the case!
Robbie
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[Wildthings]

Find a nut for a late Vanagon (get two, one for each side) and use it as the torque range is tighter and will give more consistent torque. Your initial torque will be 360 ft*lbs.

Also while you have the axle out replace both the inner and outer wheel seals. You can also pump some fresh grease into the bearings with a needle fitting attached to your grease gun.

[Eriebugger]

Wow, 360# is a lot of torque but I can check into the vanagon nuts.
What about bearings will those have to be replaced? PO said brgs were replaced on 1 side but don't know which that was.

[Wildthings]

[brando90gl]

Dead thread revival....

Brought a 68 Campmobile home a few weeks ago, so happy to have a bus again. And, all it needs is everything.

I’ve disassembled the passenger rear stub axle from the bearing housing and all went pretty smooth. However, the driver side stub axle will not succumb to the hammer. I’ve tried copious amounts of map gas heat to the housing and had the axle nut flipped and screwed on flush to allow fairly large rasps with a 5lb hammer. Will not budge.

Any other tips? I’ve read every thread on rear bearing replacement, here and on IAC, and it seems most stub axles aren’t frozen to the bearing stack like mine is. Remove housing and take it to a press?
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[kreemoweet]

You might be able to remove brake backing plate, etc., and rent one of those gigantic pullers from
an auto parts house to press the thang out. I assume you've checked for and cleaned up any burrs
on the threaded/splined part of the stub axle.
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[SGKent]

[brando90gl]

[brando90gl]

[SGKent]

you pull the nut and flange. Is the flange off?
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[brando90gl]

Press was the ticket! Axle was definitely frozen inside bearings.

Of course the stub axle needs cleaning up or polishing, but those of you with the experience, does it look serviceable?? Housing looks ok, a little rust just inside of inner seal area that I’m sure will clean up.

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67 Type 1
68 Campmobile
70 Single Cab

[SGKent]

glass bead it with a good quality bead, wash it in hot soapy water, compressed air dry, and see what it looks like afterward. I think it will be Ok. The hub surface that matters is where the bearing races sit,
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[brando90gl]

Copy that. I have a friend up the hill with a vapor blasting outfit, unless that’s a no no?
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68 Campmobile
70 Single Cab

[Rooikop]

Resurrecting this thread since seems to help me deal with potential problem?

71 Bay Window Bus which have had for 3 years: very good runner; do all maintenance myself.

Problem: Bus running no problems, then jump in for drive and after short distance a terrible "graunching" from rear right (only). Seemed to be worse when applying load to engine. Continued slowly (on motorway!); stopped twice to look at axle / hub / etc but nothing to see. Able to park up safely (and leave it) after about 5km. Returned today - a week later - with floor jack and all my tools: moved bus to suitable hard standing to work on, but during short journey of 50m or so, NO NOISE WHATSOEVER...... Much scratching of head. Took for short test run; still nothing. Drove home without any issues (another 5km). So now I need to try and fault find something that apparently is no longer there.

Plan of Action:
1. Raise bus onto secure axle stands. Give everything a good clean
2. Start engine and put it in gear; see what's what / noise(s)?
3. Check gearbox oil level / top up or even replace completely.
4. Check CV joint screws and boots.
5. Remove / check drive shaft?
6. Remove / Open Up / Repack CV joints?
7. Lube rear wheel bearing?
8. If all else fails, send to a workshop and pay for complete overhaul of gearbox / drive train? OUCH - want to avoid this if at all possible, but I really don't want this phantom symptom recurring when I'm on a long trip (drove Brussels to Stockholm and back last summer; would like to do similar next summer!)

All and any advice welcome as to my plan of attack and/or what might really be the problem.

Regards to all - you are the best!