Splitting case/changing lifters and pushrods

[modok]

I was meaning to round the edges of case split by the rear seal, if you were to actually do the "half rebuild" and the leave the flywheel on.
Works fine for me!

IMO the engle 125 is a good match for the displacement and heads.
Maybe there are a few that prefer other grinds but there are also a lot of engine builders that LOVE the 125.


The 120 is the mildest cam I'd consider unless it's a rock crawler, and don't forget different cams will want slightly different compression ratio.

[Singerdude]

Ok I cancelled the 120 cam. and I still have stuff to read before I get into messing with my comp ratio. So it is status quo for now. For now because I'm starting to toy with the idea of bumbing displacement to 2276 instead. Whoever said less is more? More is more

[modok]

oh jeez. Well......... you did want more low end torque!

[Singerdude]

Well now since the case is open, shouldn't cost an arm and a leg...

Yet again, something about the number 2110 "feels more right". I know I'm threading on esoteric territory here (and even though it's friday night I haven't been smoking lawn clippings or anything...) 🚭 But I'm built that way, a lot of my decisions are based on irrational gut feelings. Makes for a highly unpredictable life, but interesting to say the least. Now How's about I build an engine from scratch on intuition alone!!!! That would highly predictably be a disaster of epic proportions. It would still be interesting, to say the least

[Boolean]

Predictable is boring. Informed and unpredictable is lethal.
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I strive for perfection. Excellence will not be tolerated!
Build thread here:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=529379

[slalombuggy]

I've used a 125 in a couple engines and loved it. Yes it can be a little soggy down low, but you have the stroke to compensate for that and if you go bigger even more so. And having it in a buggy, you really don't need a lot of bottom end to get going. I built a 2276 for a customers Ghia and it hauled the mail with that cam. I'd keep the 125

brad

[[email protected]]

Do what you want, but I would put it back together with as little deviation from the original engine as possible. Decide on what cam you are going to use, and double check the assembly clearances/compression ratio. It's nice to upgrade "while I have it apart", but you are possibly opening up a can of worms by changing this component is now going to change this tolerance, and so on. And when are you going to "stop" with the changes. Before you know it you will be waiting on machine work, etc., and Spring will be here with the short block still on the stand. I'm all for having components that work well together, but before you know it, your cam change ends up costing you $2k because you added this, and added that.

[DeathBySnuSnu]

[Singerdude]

Gkeeton, I started last spring with a 2-3k budget in mind and as of now I'm Passed 25 000$ (Can dollars that is, but still, f-ing ouch!) yeah! been there, done that too. I replaced EVERYTHING but the pan, body, seats, lights, windshield and bumper. So now that I think about it, I should take it easy...

But what's 400$ for a set of 94's and a bit of machining now?

The builder who did the engine offers it in 2110 or 2276 with exactly the same components, would it really be that much of a can of worms tuning wise? There are a couple threads about this type of conversion so I'll read that. Brad, if you built a similar engine, I'd value your input on that.

[[email protected]]

It's not going to really open a can of worms, but it will start a chain of cause/effect things you'll need to change in the engine. They have 94's turned down to fit into the case machined for 90.5's. It's not an area of strength, but I personally don't like them. So, say you need the machine work to open up the case for 94's. Then you need to have the heads opened up. The larger cylinder will give you more compression. What is your target compression? Were you going to raise it? Can you get the target compression ratio with the ideal deck less than .060, or will the combustion chambers of the heads now be too small from the 2110? You'll be replacing the pushrods anyways, but with the 2276 you may have to figure out new rocker geometry, and cut the pushrods to a different length. And yes you most likely will need a jetting adjustment in the carbs. I just swapped a set of heads on a hi-po 1776. The old heads had 46cc chambers, and not wanting to completely chop up the new heads to possibly use them on another project, I had 53cc's on them. I then had to get longer pushrods, and reshim the side play of the rockers. Was it hard, no, but changing certian things effect other things, so plan accordingly if you do decide to go with the 2276.
Addition: The first engine I built with someone standing over me was said 1776 that ran well for 45k before I did a cam change. The third engine was similar to your situation, I took apart a stroker engine by myself, freshing it up, reassembling it in the exact manner it came apart. I was one of the ones encouraging you to do the job yourself. I'm glad your confidence has grown since taking things apart, but going from someone that was going to take a stocker apart to see how it works to someone wanting to modify their stroker is usually a pretty big leap for most enthusiasts.

[slalombuggy]

Yes having more displacement is fun. Now, having said that. I am going to a 1904 for my buggy down from a 2332. Why? Because I don't need all that power on the street and rarely get to use it. Don't get me wrong having 200+ hp on tap is a boat load of fun but it's a lot of work. If I were in your shoes, d stick with the displacement you have, replace the parts you need to and enjoy. You said yourself, you really don't get to stretch it out much, so why go bigger?

The 2276 I built was a great engine, so great it scared the shit out of the guys wife and made him uncomfortable to the point where I ended up getting the engine from him for cash and a bone stock 1600. When I built the motor he said he wanted to keep up with his buddies in their 911s so that's the motor I gave him and he hated it. Be careful what you ask for, you might get it.

That motor had ported 044 42x37.5 heads, 9.5:1 compression, 48 IDFs, Engle 125, 1 5/8 merged header. Was a bit soft down low in a Ghia ragtop, but once it got up on the cam it was a bullet.

brad

[Singerdude]

Brad, to be quite frank, I thought at first that a 2110 in a buggy would be a bit too much, but then I've grown accustomed to it. Now that all the suspension has been properly setup and that I've switched the swingaxle for an IRS, it is in another category handling wise. I drive it a lot through villages and on country roads where I can't open it a lot passed 80km/h. I also do a lot of highway driving.

But just like your client I'd like to keep up with my main driving buddy, my brother who's got a Mini Cooper S. And I could, even get in front without too much effort. That was before he started the arms race by upgrading his supercharger pulley, putting a chip in it and installing a hi-perf exhaust line!!! Gosh I wish I had a 6 speed tranny too.... And also, a lot of it has to do with the fact that I'd be proud to be able to say that I did it Myself.

Wich brings us to the info Gkeeton offered. Eye opening! I thought with candor that I could get away with a cylinders and jugs swap, bolt everything back together and be good to go. I guess I know just enough to be dangerous anyway I ordered the "How to hotrod your Volkswaggen" book and will read that cover to cover before doing anything radical.

Thanks a million to all of you guys for generously helping.

[Singerdude]

That said, Brad, one of my first posts here on the Samba was on someone elses thread who was about to buy his first engine and was asking for info about X and Y displacements. If I remember correctly you answered that you built both for different custommers. I noticed that you were from Canada and posted there that I was looking for a builder for a turnkey as well and that I would much rather encourage a fellow Canadian and by-pass the customs hassles... You never answered on that one and I kinda moved on. I guess I could've PM'd you... No hard feelings there at all.

[Singerdude]

Spoke with Greg Tims this morning... Modok you were right, the valves are Pep. At 8$ a pop they're mighty cheap too! I ordered a set from the Tims ' and they should be here by the end of the week. It is hard to wait with a bright 72 degrees outside... Chances are it was the last warm day of the season for us from the great white north... By the time I get the engine up and running it'll be COLD. But I intend on driving this thing for as long as there isn't any snow on the road. Even if it means wearing winter apparel. Kinda goes against the idea of the whole beach buggy thing but I don't mind. I invested too much not to...

That's if I don't seize/ blow up the engine because of a faulty assembly. That would be a bummer but not much of a surprise When we wrenched on dirtbikes we used to kid around saying "If you have less than 3 bolts left after putting the thing back together, you're good to go". I will definitely try to bring that number down to zero.

[modok]

Good deal!
Just put on a Ushanka, wool socks, ect. LOL

[Singerdude]

Ok I just got an adjustable pushrod, can't wait to figure the new geometry out... today I'm going to get seafoam and a toothbrush to dislodge carbon from heads/pistons. I will probably re-assemble the short-block this evening. Quick question: Should I apply some camshield to the new lifter faces? Shold I also put a dab of it on the cam lobes? The cam is the old 125...

The only bummer I got is the Tims didn't send me the invoice/paypal payment for the valves yet so they won't be here for the weekend.

Also I bought a spring compressor to get the valves out but the tabs that hold on to the colis are too short and the inner coils dont compress (I've got duals). So that,s gonna go back to the autoparts shop and I will try to get the kind of compressor that looks like an oversize vise-grip...

[slalombuggy]

Hey , sorry I never answered about a Canadian builder. I must not have seen your request or I would have answered. I put the cam lube on everything, lobes and lifters. If you think you may be working on heads more than a few times in the years to come you should look at the bench mounted spring tool from CIP1. If you get the c-clamp style compressor make sure you are careful that the end that fits on valve head end doesn't gouge into the head. It can be a bit tricky to get them to clear with our small chambers.

brad

[modok]

If you have large drill press you can use that as a spring compressor.
requires an angle plate to hold the head right (can be made of wood), and something like these:
https://www.goodson.com/Valv-Spring-Compressor-Adaptors/

[esde]

From the gallery. This is quick and easy if you have a welder. Can be used on the car too

I made one like this, easy. Again, some welding required

[Singerdude]

Geeewhizzz. The c-clamps were order only and cost north of 125$, the Cip1 tool is only 50 bucks but unfortunately they're out of stock. But neighbor's father got some clamps that he can lend. I unfortunately don't have a welder or a drill press. They're among the stuff I'm looking forward to acquire though.

Shortblock assembly was post-poned till friday.

Brian don't worry, I know you're a good fella. You'll be on my calling list again once I'm tired of wasting money thinking I'm a mechanic