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freddie89 Samba Member
Joined: November 20, 2010 Posts: 39 Location: Leicester, England
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Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:27 am Post subject: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. |
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Hi all, I have tried to search for a simple answer to this question but cant find one!
Basically am looking to fit a 60's short axle box into my 1951 crotch cooler, What do I need to do?
Thanks
Freddie |
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Mr. Okrasa Original Old Speed
Joined: May 20, 2000 Posts: 727 Location: Eastside, Costa Mesa. So. Califas...Loco's ;-)
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Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:41 am Post subject: Re: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. |
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freddie89 wrote: |
Hi all, I have tried to search for a simple answer to this question but cant find one!
Basically am looking to fit a 60's short axle box into my 1951 crotch cooler, What do I need to do?
Thanks
Freddie |
Break out the welding torch! I've contemplated the same thing as I want to install a Berg 5 speed behinde a Denzel engine in my 1950 VW Beetle WITHOUT cutting/welding the original chassis structure but cant figure it out. If you want to install a tunnel type full synchro trans and still use a rubber factory mount, you have to modifly the nose cone from a type 2 bus. I have such a mount that allows you to do that WITHOUT any cutting nor welding of your mount nor chassis. I recieved this modified nose cone when I purchase one of my Split Window 356 Coupes. I asked the owner, "what a funny nose cone". He said that it was made to adapt a full type 1 tunnel/synchro transmission into your split beetle/356 chassis without no modifications. Now, if only someone can re-cast it and make them available to the general public. Cheers. Mr. Okrasa _________________
See my Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/okrasa/
1959 VW Karmann Ghia Coupe / Bamboo-Green / Denzel 1300cc / OG. owner, paint
Denzel engine running. See this link: https://youtu.be/DgUlsQDTXTE
VW www.Okrasa.com
356 www.PreA356.com |
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Bruce Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003 Posts: 17296 Location: Left coast, Canada
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Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:46 pm Post subject: Re: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. |
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Mr. Okrasa wrote: |
If you want to install a tunnel type full synchro trans and still use a rubber factory mount, you have to modifly the nose cone from a type 2 bus. I have such a mount that allows you to do that WITHOUT any cutting nor welding of your mount nor chassis. |
Pictures or it didn't happen! _________________
overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
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Jacks Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2006 Posts: 2348 Location: San Clemente, Ca.
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splitjunkie Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 4095
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Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:46 am Post subject: |
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I have seen that one before. It pushes the transmission back by 1/4" from what he says. Probably not too big of a deal.
To me it just doesn't look too strong. I hope it is and will hold up because it could prevent a lot of spits from being cut to put a later trans in. Seems to me that it it was welded together it would be a lot stronger. _________________ Chris
You know, a lot of these scratches will buff right out... Jerry Seinfeld |
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EverettB Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000 Posts: 69832 Location: Phoenix Metro
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beetleseb Samba Member
Joined: November 09, 2006 Posts: 430 Location: Cheltenham UK
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Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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Bears motorsport here in the UK are planning to make such a nosecone
I'm trying it in both my 50 bug and my 56 bus for them. It should sit the box in the stock location and bolt up like a factory conversion
They are very busy and its taking a long time as its a spare time project. But it will happen one day!!
Seb _________________ Wanted - OG 50 split bug door panels, brown mats and old running boards |
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splitjunkie Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 4095
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Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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That's cool. Looks much like Concept1 was planning but didn't have the time.
keep us updated. _________________ Chris
You know, a lot of these scratches will buff right out... Jerry Seinfeld |
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gazlaw75 Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2010 Posts: 14 Location: worcestershire UK
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Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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I have a 1956 era type 2 nose cone on a 1959 full syncro box in my 1950, all holding up fine. no cutting, no welding, no hassle. |
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splitjunkie Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 4095
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Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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The '59 tranny is not full synchromesh. First is not syncromesh on the split case transmissions.
Your solution for using a split case bus nose cone is the best way to put a split case syncro in a split but what this thread is about is putting a '61 and later full syncromesh tunnel, non split case tranny in a split. _________________ Chris
You know, a lot of these scratches will buff right out... Jerry Seinfeld |
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Jacks Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2006 Posts: 2348 Location: San Clemente, Ca.
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eurodub Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2007 Posts: 1321
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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hmm... that does look clever enough!
i don't know if the urethane piece is glued good enough on the metal piece, but this system seems a nice setup. i don't know if the trans hits the upper section while shifting gears though, or if the trans nosecone is strong enough not to break.
i have a tunnel trans in my split and it's a pia. the front mount is bolted right to the chassis and the engine moves too much when i shift into gears. as i don't have at least a decent splitcase trans to mount a bus nosecone, i really need to find a good tested solution. _________________ 1960 1200 model 117 deluxe ragtop
1974 T2 Westfalia Campmobile
1976 MK1 Golf |
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splitjunkie Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 4095
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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That doesn't look like a very good design. There is hardly anything holding the doughnut in and it does not fill the entire hole. I am not sure what that retainer is supposed to do.
If the urethane mount was a full circle like the orginial with a hole in the center of the mount for the shift support and if it had a retaining plate that actually held the doughnut in, it might be pretty good.
I bet it caused the engine to be placed farther back in the vehicle like the other mount earlier in the thread. _________________ Chris
You know, a lot of these scratches will buff right out... Jerry Seinfeld |
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bally Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 1182 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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Has anyone tried this kit? Any feedback?
I'm planning on putting a March 63 tunnel trans in my 51. If I'm to stick a bus nose cone on it, which year bus nose cone do I need?
I'd love to have the proposed Bears nose cone - that sounds like the best solution, but I'm not sure how much longer it will be in development.
Cheers,
Dave |
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Trevor P Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2004 Posts: 863 Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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Go with the Concept 1 mount.
It doesn't move anything back if the front rubber mount is prepped right. I cut 1/4" off the front rubber mount and everything fits in stock position just like it should. I'm running a 2180 and a later trans in my BD and it has held up just fine. We have run these mounts in buses driving from Canada to Cali 2 times (and many more kms since) with no issues. _________________ 53 Canadian standard oval
56 Wolfsburg PG/SG
57 Oval, 2332 & Berg 5
70 911T
91 Westy |
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bally Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 1182 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:33 am Post subject: |
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Trevor P wrote: |
Go with the Concept 1 mount.
It doesn't move anything back if the front rubber mount is prepped right. I cut 1/4" off the front rubber mount and everything fits in stock position just like it should. I'm running a 2180 and a later trans in my BD and it has held up just fine. We have run these mounts in buses driving from Canada to Cali 2 times (and many more kms since) with no issues. |
Thanks for your input Trevor.
The ad the link further up the thread referred to had expired so I assumed these were no longer available. Not only are they still available, they are on sale!
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1382539
There is no mention of trimming the front rubber mount to get it all to fit as VW intended. Are they missing a trick here?
I do like the idea of this mount and using the original rubber bushing.
Cheers,
Dave |
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Trevor P Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2004 Posts: 863 Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:59 am Post subject: |
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Trimming the mount is a trick we found out doing the last couple installs. Make sure to lube the mount up really good so it slips in as the WW rubber is a tight fit. _________________ 53 Canadian standard oval
56 Wolfsburg PG/SG
57 Oval, 2332 & Berg 5
70 911T
91 Westy |
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bally Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 1182 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:29 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Trevor - that sounds like good advice
What's the top tip for trimming the rubber donut so it doesn't look like a hack job?
Maybe the advert should be updated with this top tip - I know it puts people off as is. It might also be worth producing narrower donuts specifically for these mounts although that may not be financially viable.
Cheers,
Dave |
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Trevor P Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2004 Posts: 863 Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:57 am Post subject: |
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It's about a 2 minute job with a bandsaw or a 5 min job with a hacksaw. Trim the 1/4" off the front of the rubber mount (the narrow end of the taper) and clean it up with a quick sanding on a belt sander. Once installed you will never see it but the belt sander does a nice job of tidying it up. _________________ 53 Canadian standard oval
56 Wolfsburg PG/SG
57 Oval, 2332 & Berg 5
70 911T
91 Westy |
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bally Samba Member
Joined: April 29, 2006 Posts: 1182 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Ok, thanks.
Dave |
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