New Owner- 64 Body on 77 Chassis

[RangerGhost169]

Hi All,

So, I recently purchased a 64 Beetle riding on a 77 chassis. I want to get the stance better than it currently is. I've read all of the posts regarding IRS pan swaps, track widths, wheelbases, etc.

Car is set up with 2-1/2" drop spindles and disc brakes all the way around which I know increases the track width by about 3/4" per wheel. Fronts currently sit 1/4" proud of the fender lips. Rears have a slight bit of camber. Running 205/70's in the rear and 185/60's up front on chrome stocks.

My goal is to get the car looking like a SoCal "hot rod" with big rubber in the back and smaller tires up front. Not necessarily slamming it, but a slight bit of tuck on the rears would be awesome.

Couple questions-

1. The rears don't look perfectly centered in the fenders. The tire gap is smaller towards the front of the fenders than the rear. Will this be a problem if I drop the rear with the spring plates?

2. There is nothing I can do with the front other than getting a narrowed/adjustable beam, correct? Why do they cost so much??? Didn't realize this before I purchased the car.

I welcome any and all commentary. TheSamba has been a wealth of knowledge in the early ownership.

[Busstom]

Have you pulled up the back seat to look at the VIN and verify the year and try to narrow down the origin of the chassis?

Your rear wheel spacing (fore/aft) looks normal, possibly just a bit toe-in, and maybe an aftermarket fender (<-- almost assured).

You said "Rears have a slight bit of camber." What type of camber? Positive, or negative? From here, it looks positive, which is usually indicative of swing axle suspension. But if it's a U.S. delivery '77, it should be IRS. See first sentence above.

So, you need to specify the rear suspension type (swing or IRS) and front suspension type (link pin or ball joint). I see the bottom of the shock tower so I know it's not strut. Again, see first sentence above.

Front beams are not expensive, you're probably just thinking "Bugs are cheap."

If you want to lower the rear, then skip the "spring plates" and put the savings toward a narrowed beam. Then lower the rear by reindexing the splines. Same result. No. Better result. Using spline adjustments, you can infinitely dial the ride height from side to side, leveling the car while optimizing your desired ride height.
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My name's Steve and it's pronounced "Bust 'em" (cuz people think I'm Tom) 😏

[RangerGhost169]

Thanks Buss-

Yes, the chassis VIN is from 77. It's also titled as a 77. Not sure on country of origin...
Definitely an IRS car with a ball joint beam.

Thanks for the reply!

[Root_Werks]

Most drop spindles push the track out 1/4" - 3/8". Then there is wheel offset, tire size etc.

Here's a good thread on actual zero offset spindles that recently came out:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=777577&start=0

Myself and a few others have installed with very positive results. That may be an option for you. Measure your track, if it's not stock for 1977, probably could swap out for zero offset spindles and at least get back to stock track width.

-Dan
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When I set my timing, why do I flush, then take a pee?

[heimlich]

That car looks good to me.
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[Dusty1]

Car looks good to me, too.

Bear in mind you're messing with one of the finest suspension designs ever built. Ever hear of Ferdinand Porsche? He designed your VW and its suspension. You're driving the original "Porsche".

Question for you. Are you an engineer? If not, what qualifies you to mess with the geometry of your VW suspension?

Your current stance should handle and drive well.


The "tucked" look:

It's generally achieved on watercooled VWs and similar cars by using wheels "too wide" for the tires as well as lowering the ride height. That means the tire bead protrudes farther than the tread. The tread "tucks" under the fender for the tucked look.

On aircooled, you want to go for the same curved sidewall. It's easiest with swingaxle which is kinda too late for your IRS converted '64. Rudely lowering the rear of the car cambers what rear wheels and achieves the "tucked" look.

What generally goes unsaid:

You're compromising handling and perhaps even safety for appearance.

You're trying to achieve a particular combination of wheels, tires and stance. If you haven't done this before you may throw a ton of money at it before you get it "right".

The tighter your tuck, the more likely it is your fender lips are going to munch your sidewalls over bumps. That means one good pothole is going to wreck at least one of your rear fenders, your paint and your tires.


To reiterate, extreme lowering typically compromises handling and safety for appearance.


If you're concerned about the cost of lowering your '64 just sell it to me. I wouldn't throw that one outta bed for eatin' crackers.

I drive back roads every chance I get. If anything the squirrels prefer raised cars over lowered.

.
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[EVfun]

[Busstom]

^ ^ ^ ^ This sums it up pretty well.

OP is after the Cal Look. The DKP have historically set the standard for this look so maybe some informational reference can provide guidance. It's all of course open to interpretation and personal preference, but wheel choices can be a big factor in differentiating Cal from the "German" look.

Their site hasn't been maintained so much for a couple years, their IG page is more current with higher-res pics. Of course, you have to have an IG account to blow up the pictrues. I see a lot of old members listed who were very active in the old Cal-Look.com forum back in the early 2000's. https://www.instagram.com/derkleinerpanzers/?hl=en

https://dkpcarclub.com/blog/about-our-club-2/
_________________
My name's Steve and it's pronounced "Bust 'em" (cuz people think I'm Tom) 😏

[Dusty1]