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Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:19 pm

I am looking to insure my Beetle, and would like to self insure as much as possible. My largest concern is having my Beetle declared total loss, or "salvage" (with a stigma "salvage title" if it is hit). Even if it is substantially damaged, I would like to avoid getting a "salvage title".

It always seemed strange that a third party (my chosen insurer) is able to define the state of my car to the state - and I don't want to over-insure to mitigate this. Insuring based whatever my insurance company feels like it is worth would provide the cheapest, but also the most likely to be declared a total loss if a get a dent in the fender or some such.

What is the best way to handle this, and reduce the change of having my car deemed "salvage" if it is in an accident?

Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:32 pm

Search on threads like these. Collectors insurance is affordable and lets you state its insured value:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9977903
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=446660
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=489462
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4750814

Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:43 pm

Check out Hagerty and the "Cherished Salvage" coverage they offer.

https://www.hagerty.com/insurance/classic-car-insu...e-coverage

Their policies are for guaranteed value rather than stated value ... not the same thing. There seem to be lots of positive comments about them in other threads so probably worth looking into.

Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:06 pm

I agrre "cherished salvage" is a great option - but it only happens after a car is declared a total loss. Any ideas on strategies to avoid that designation to begin with?

Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:28 pm

The only way to be 100% sure your car is not totaled... is to not accept payment from the insurance company.

If you don't take the check then they don't own it and the title is not changed to Salvage.

There comes a point that an insurance company will not reimburse you for damage. That amount is more than the car is worth.

The value of sentiment value is $0.

I've seen people put $10,000 into a rusty Super Beetle and that was only rust/rot repair, not a total restoration. And when done the car is is only worth $3000. They understand that and do it anyway.

This car is not repairable... everything would have to be replaced since the fire damaged destroyed the integrity of the metal.

Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:34 pm

Glenn wrote: The only way to be 100% sure your car is not totaled... is to not accept payment from the insurance company.

If you don't take the check then they don't own it and the title is not changed to Salvage.

That's interesting! I thought the insurance company determined if it was salvage, regardless as to if you took their money or not. If you don't accept payment, the title doesn't change?

Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:47 pm

harrymarlin wrote: Glenn wrote: The only way to be 100% sure your car is not totaled... is to not accept payment from the insurance company.

If you don't take the check then they don't own it and the title is not changed to Salvage.

That's interesting! I thought the insurance company determined if it was salvage, regardless as to if you took their money or not. If you don't accept payment, the title doesn't change?
If you don't hand them the title, how can it change? Someone needs to inform DMV, they can't since they don't own it.

Here's another that can't be fixed.

Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:51 pm

That will buff out, Glenn

Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:43 pm

Gee Harry, I would call Hagerty and ask them to explain how “Cherished Salvage” works.

I spoke to them several months ago and my understanding is that “Cherished Salvage” is an add-on to the policy for which you pay extra (I think the added charge is equal to 15% of whatever premium you pay for the guaranteed coverage you want). As I understand it, in the event of a total loss, you are paid the guaranteed value of the vehicle and you keep the vehicle. Since there is no transfer of ownership, I don’t see why there would be a change in the title status. You can do whatever you want with the vehicle … repair it, donate it, part it out, sell for scrap … or make yard art out of it and see how that goes over with the neighbors (or HOA :shock: ).

This is a deal for you because you collect the guaranteed value and get to keep the car. It is also a deal for Hagerty because they collect the additional premium for the “Cherished Salvage” benefit and don’t have to deal with the expenses involved with taking possession of the car (administrative paperwork/fees, towing it away, storage, and disposal … whatever form that takes).

It seems like it would give you the coverage you want without having to worry about ending up with a salvage title. It is well worth giving them a call to confirm the details of the coverage and “Cherished Salvage” benefit.

Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:50 pm

The estigma of salvage title...I would think that only applies if you are trying to sale it. It affects the value....but , you aren't selling it.

Thu Jan 26, 2023 9:55 pm

However …

If you are in an accident and you are at fault, I think the only other way to avoid the dreaded salvage title would be to have just liability coverage so you are covered for vehicle or property damage and injury you cause to someone else. Since you wouldn’t have any collision or comprehensive coverage, you then bear the expense of any damage or loss to your vehicle including whatever value it has if it is damaged beyond repair or stolen. (Unless you have Hagerty with full coverage and the 'Cherished Salvage' benefit ... I think).

If you are in an accident and the other person is at fault, you’d end up filing a claim with their insurance company … and they will want to pay as little as possible. It is entirely possible that even relatively minor damage will cost as much or more to repair than their insurance company believes your car is worth. If you accept what they are willing to pay, I believe the car would be considered totaled … and there’s your salvage title. So, to avoid the salvage title you’d have to decline their damage settlement and eat the loss yourself … even though you’re not at fault. This scenario fits with what Glenn was saying.

I think most of us who have invested a good deal of time and money into our classic cars drive them with care. This is especially true if the car is a family heirloom. That being the case, it seems much more likely in this world of distracted driving that someone else will be at fault in an accident and we will be faced with dealing with their insurance company. Hard to imagine a satisfactory outcome in such a situation.

Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:47 am

Insure is for the car, Ensure is for the Samba poster. I get dizzy reading about ignition systems which brake.

Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:34 am

Abscate wrote: Insure is for the car, Ensure is for the Samba poster. I get dizzy reading about ignition systems which brake.
I see what you did ;)

Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:59 am

I have definitely learned a lot of insurance from this thread, and I really appreciate the responses. I was under the belief that a car could be considered "totaled" by an insurance company, and that caused the state to change the title type. I didn't realize that could only happen if I accepted the payment from the insurance.

I get that this only really matters if I decide to sell the car, but I like the keep my options open. I also don't like the idea of the "salvage title" for my car, regardless.

Thanks for all of the links, and I've been talking with Hagarty, so I'll probably move off of my current insurance to them, soon (along with "cherished salvage" option.

Fri Jan 27, 2023 2:45 pm

I just added the "Cherished Salvage" endorsement to my Hagerty Policy.
$26/year and I hope I never have to find out if it is worth it.

Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:18 pm

in the early 2000's many flippers were buying wrecked cars and putting them back together. In some cases people had half of one car, half of another and a fresh paint job, with no idea that their car(s) had been wrecked. People were dying in some cases when the cars broke. As a result the states passed laws on salvaged car titles such that when a car is a write off, or sold under some liens, it is required by all 50 states to show a "salvage" title. My bus has a salvage title, it had 12 - 15 parking tickets on it from sitting unused in front of the first owner's house. The second owner bought it and had run thru a friend's towing service as a mechanics lien to get rid of about $2500 in tickets and penalties. That caused it to have a salvage title. It is not a big thing. In antique aircraft, many are salvaged, even rebuild out of a VIN plate and old engine someone found in a collection. In those "vintage" aircraft, that cost millions of dollars, the only part that may be original is the Serial Number tag. When I bought this bus, I talked with USAA about it and they told me that they see salvage titles everyday, and that it has no effect on the value of the vehicle whatsoever. The type repairs done are what determines that. Someone could lose a two week old car to an <racist term removed> who drives it across the country. The car is written off as stolen and then found 3 months later in some parking lot in another state. By then it is now a salvage vehicle because it was reported stolen and an insurance claim. It might have been sitting in the same spot three months, and the only thing it needs is to be washed and the McDonald wrappers on the floor tossed in the trash. With a fine detailing it would be like a new car. But under all 50 state laws it has to be a branded title. Especially on old cars it means nothing. The only exception might be if you have a rare numbers matching, 60's muscle car with 3 miles on it that was in a collection all its life.

Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:09 pm

SGKent wrote: When I bought this bus, I talked with USAA about it and they told me that they see salvage titles everyday, and that it has no effect on the value of the vehicle whatsoever.
I would get it in writing because:
I've been told directly from my insurance in the past that they will not pay out as much on salvaged vehicles because they have already been fully paid out once.

Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:22 pm

Abscate wrote: Insure is for the car, Ensure is for the Samba poster. I get dizzy reading about ignition systems which brake.

Stinky123 wrote: that only applies if you are trying to sale it.

I insured my car to sell it, but needed a dose of Ensure for the sale, cuz the brakes failed when the dizzy took a shit.

Also, a salvage title only really matter if a buyer tries to get a bank loan against it. Most lenders will not do a regular auto loan for a vehicle with a salvage title. Can probably get a personal loan at nearly double the interest rate, though.

Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:24 pm

SGKent wrote: in the early 2000's many flippers were buying wrecked cars and putting them back together. In some cases people had half of one car, half of another and a fresh paint job, with no idea that their car(s) had been wrecked.

My dad busted a guy doing this same thing with wrecked Volvo's back in the mid 80's. I need to ask him if he recalls when they started branding titles. He was a MN state Trooper for 27 years.

Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:17 pm

For F sake someone change the title of this thread.