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Thu Dec 16, 2021 11:12 am

wheel607 wrote: Ray, I remember the Michelin tires of the 1960s and they were the BEST tire for VW for the money. Fast forward, and to answer some of your and Mukluks question about MODERN Michelins.........They are crap. If you cant be guaranteed and cant buy them without the HIGH shipping costs associated with an overseas purchase, why bother. I bought the MODERN XZX that Corkey Coker sells and it was total crap. Four of the five tires I bought were out of round. I even bought the additional insurance. Guess what , they didnt do ANYTHING for me. Again, you will get a clerk, probably sitting at home in his or her pajamas, that has a form to fill out and you, and you will never get to talk with the same person again. It is the same everywhere....just think what it will be like buying and getting the warranty performed overseas. I personally think the whitewall is another "gimmick" to sell more tires. I would think if Coker has them....he would advertise his CRAPPY tires for sale. I put on Faulken ZE912 tires and it is like the Michelins of old. Very satisfied, dont like the tread, but love the ride.

Coker is selling the same tire. I asked, the whitewall is on it's way stuck in a container ship. I wanted to like them but at that price and what I'm hearing I won't be trying them. Maybe after some better feedback. They look fantastic

I also see that Coker is coming back with the Michelin 135SR15 XZX so you can do the big and little look

Thu Dec 16, 2021 2:26 pm

Coad, it took me hours but when you get older, you have more time to think. That Ghia I bought new had 4 of the 165 Michelins installed NEW at the dealership for I believe was $69 total extra on the new car invoice. It had one of the CONVENTIONALS in the spare tire area, and I remember making a big deal out of this not being the same as the 4 that were on the car. The reason, just like you said, was that it wouldnt fit because of the largeness of the radial. It took a while but VW didnt install it, the 165, because it wouldnt fit. All of the rest fit fine, but as I remember, with very little clearance. Hope this helps.

Thu Dec 16, 2021 3:42 pm

Thank you for the answers and information so far. The last time I'd run a set of XZX tires was back in the 90s on my old '68 Bug, and from what I recall they were a very good tire back then (although that view may be skewed by the passage of time and the fact they replaced an old set of bias ply Firestones). With my current tires approaching the age where I should consider replacement and wishing to keep my options open, I wanted to get a feel for what's out there that fits my requirements of a good quality tire with a bit of a vintage vibe. From the sound of things so far I believe it likely I'll stick with Vredsteins.

Fri Dec 17, 2021 6:45 pm

mukluk wrote: Thank you for the answers and information so far. The last time I'd run a set of XZX tires was back in the 90s on my old '68 Bug, and from what I recall they were a very good tire back then (although that view may be skewed by the passage of time and the fact they replaced an old set of bias ply Firestones). With my current tires approaching the age where I should consider replacement and wishing to keep my options open, I wanted to get a feel for what's out there that fits my requirements of a good quality tire with a bit of a vintage vibe. From the sound of things so far I believe it likely I'll stick with Vredsteins.
As I'm sure you are well aware, the Vreds are available in 155 size which a lot of folks feel is closer to the original 5.60/15

Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:00 am

mukluk wrote: I wanted to get a feel for what's out there that fits my requirements of a good quality tire with a bit of a vintage vibe. From the sound of things so far I believe it likely I'll stick with Vredsteins.

I dont understand this?

I understand why you want the tyre you describe, but i cannot understand how that brings you to the answer Vresdstein?

Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:15 am

[quote="Erik G"] wheel607 wrote:

I also see that Coker is coming back with the Michelin 135SR15 XZX so you can do the big and little look

Though they are very similar the 135R15 Michelin is a ZX not an XZX https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michelin-classic-tyres/xzx/135sr15-michelin-zx.html

However if you want to do the smaller fron tyre with exactly the same tread pattern then Michelin do make the 145R15 XZX https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michelin-classic-tyres/xzx/145sr15-michelin-xzx.html

However, it wouldnt concern me mixing the 2 tread patterns on different axles, its just a fashion thing, in the flesh they look very similar. At least you have tyres that are good quality and have a vintage vibe.

I have to say, i am suprised that you guys think these tyres are expensive. when you look at our sets of 4 and 5 white wall 165R15 XZX tyres, i think they come out as cheap as anything.

Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:59 am

From your link......for the XZX.....before tax ~$165 each? Yes.....thats damned expensive for a "normal" size tire.

Yes....I expect high prices for something like low profile, wide high performance tires. I put new tires on my parents Audi A6 with 21 x8" tires and 35 series profile.....and they werd $525 each.

However for example.....new Bridgestone mud and snow....just excellent tires....195/65-15 for my Golf.....and this same size would slip right onto my 412 with its 5.5 x 15 rims.....I csn get those (and many tires like them) for between $95 and $120 each maximum....before tax, mounting and balance.

So back to your prices.....~$165 each before tax? .....and ~$197 after tax? Thats pretty high.

Yes....I realize there must be SOME KIND of premium to be paid for a limited run "classic car" tire.....but this is exactly why the build quality comes into question. If they cost that much and I am going to risk my pride and joy rolling on them.....they better have at minimum....the tread compunds and performance of the original. Ray

Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:35 am

Hi

But what tyre can you get in the size 165R15 that is cheaper? and if you can it isnt a period tyre, and it isnt anywhere near the quality of a Michelin.

a modern tyre that is produced in the millions with a current and generic carcass structure is just goin g to be considerably cheaper to produce and distribute. I think it is pretty amazing that the prices are as close as they are.

There is no doubt about the quality of the Michelin classic tyres. Just because someone has posted a thread about his car not being set up right. His issues are not down to the quality of the tyre, he has a binding brake, dickie track rod or some other geometry isse. catagorically not a tyre issue. We sell loads of these tyres and we do not have quality issues with Michelin tyres.

Fitting a correct size period tyre on a classic car handles better, and is kinder to your car. When you have a tyre with the consistent build quality of that Michelin XZX it is one of the cheapest things you can do to improve the drive of your car.

Tue Dec 21, 2021 8:49 am

I tried the xzx tires when my Beetle was my daily driver back in the 80s. They were great when new, but seemed to get hard and lose traction in rain after a couple of years.

Very few people use these cars as daily drivers any more, and almost no one drives them in rain or snow or bad weather. Anything that holds air and gets you to the ice cream stand on a sunny sunday is good enough for 99% of air-cooled VW owners.

Tue Dec 21, 2021 10:08 am

I don't see the point in a car you can't drive all season. I have been commuting in mine the last couple weeks, and about half of those days have been in fairly heavy rain, and the other half have been nearly 40F degrees in the mornings. I currently run Mojave touring tires from American Tire in 185/65 size, and in some pretty sketchy rain they have been great, and they have plenty of grip. My previous experience with coker white walls on my 58 was less than favorable in the rain. How can a tire that costs four times as much have such poor wet weather performance? It's cosmetic trailer car considerations that leave me speechless on these things.

Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:52 pm

Dougal Cawley wrote: Hi

But what tyre can you get in the size 165R15 that is cheaper? and if you can it isnt a period tyre, and it isnt anywhere near the quality of a Michelin.

a modern tyre that is produced in the millions with a current and generic carcass structure is just goin g to be considerably cheaper to produce and distribute. I think it is pretty amazing that the prices are as close as they are.

There is no doubt about the quality of the Michelin classic tyres. Just because someone has posted a thread about his car not being set up right. His issues are not down to the quality of the tyre, he has a binding brake, dickie track rod or some other geometry isse. catagorically not a tyre issue. We sell loads of these tyres and we do not have quality issues with Michelin tyres.

Fitting a correct size period tyre on a classic car handles better, and is kinder to your car. When you have a tyre with the consistent build quality of that Michelin XZX it is one of the cheapest things you can do to improve the drive of your car.

Ok....a couple of things. A period correct skinny ass tire....rarely handles BETTER. It may hand le correct for what came from the factory.....but that ia rarely BETTER than a modern tread with modern compounds in a slightly wider width and lower profile. Juat trying to help you out in your quoted benefits here.... :wink:

See....the other thing....the reason you are catching some flack.....is that you are speaking to TWO distinct groups of people here.

1. Those of us who spend just as much $$$$$$ and time on our cars as one who is doing a "PERIOD" restoration.....but we are NOT actually doing a period restoration.....JUST and ONLY for period specific looks.

Unlike one who is doing a period restoration.....which is just for looks .....WE.... in this group....plan to drive our cars either in a limited fashion but for long distances or drive them frequently or daily.
In other words.....they will see vritually all normal weather and driving conditions.....probably except serious ice and snow for most because we do not want to deal with salt damage.

This means highway speeds....stop and go traffic with braking ....wet pavement.
So......period correct LOOKS are 100% worthless.....if you cannot really tell us about the manufacturing quality and performance.....compared to the ORIGINAL XZX and ZX.

See.....those tires back in their day.....while they may not be as advanced as modern tire tread designs and compounds ....we actually drove them daily on these cars....and they did pretty damned well. Good enough if you drive carefully.

So.....I am not against them. But I would want them QUANTIFIED for performance and build quality....especially at that cost. Because....Michelin quality actually means no more than anyones quality anymore. They have superb tires.....but not all of their tires are superb. That goes for all tire manufacturers.

The last set of Michelins I had SUCKED. Yes....they lasted 60k miles ....but from ahout 35k on they sucked on wet to dry pavement transistions. That issue is uncharacteristic for Michelin who pretty much invented temperature variable tread compounds....so I know it was just the specific tire model.

2. The second group.....are those who ARE doing period restorations. About 90% of those people value the period LOOKS, TIRE SIZE and even the model and tread pattern....far more than whether they actually drive, roll, grip, stop, corner or even last like the original. As long as they are marginally safe to drive to the local "coffee and cars" or onto the trailer for the next show.....they dont much care.

As for can I get tires in this size for a better price? Yes....a little better.

Vredestein 165/80-15 Sprint Classic are $134.38 each in quantity of one or about,$125 each in quantity of 4 before tax.....and 155/80-15 are $116.35 in quantity of one and a little less in quantity of 4. Or the same size in BF Goodrich radial TA with a UTQG rating of 400 A B....which is pretty good....for $134.34 for quantity or one and a little less for four before tax.

So.....for the expense of the "Michelins"....which is high but not out line.....they better have a little more going for them than the Michelin name and period "looks".

My only question.....is that since these tires have been back on the market...which I think is great......there has been lots of anecdotal reviews on line that says the quality may not be what it was. Ray

Tue Dec 21, 2021 9:45 pm

Dougal Cawley has STILL not answered the questions posted to him on this small thread. He would rather criticize the crowd as having a "binding brake" or a "dickie track rod". He is a company man, through and through. Yes, I am another person that has had a set of NEW Michelin XZX radials that "sucked". Lets see, If I do the math right, thats TWO people out of the Eight that have posted.

Fri Dec 24, 2021 11:53 pm

Does anyone actually own a set of the Michelin whitewalls this thread is about. I would love to see a good picture of them and what they look like installed. Unlike some of the people commenting here, I do want an original looking whitewall for my VW. The thickness of the whitewall and the look it gives is important to me for a fully original restored look.

Sat Dec 25, 2021 9:52 am

Volktales wrote: Does anyone actually own a set of the Michelin whitewalls this thread is about. I would love to see a good picture of them and what they look like installed. Unlike some of the people commenting here, I do want an original looking whitewall for my VW. The thickness of the whitewall and the look it gives is important to me for a fully original restored look.

They look fantastic and if you are only going for looks, I don't think there is a better tire. I don't believe anyone has them in North America yet, they are stuck in a container floating around somewhere. The white wall is over an inch so that may be too big for some people. BF Goodrich 165R15 with a 3/4 inch white wall is available but last I looked is a more modern logo than they used to be.

Sat Jan 08, 2022 2:50 pm

Just got these Michelin XZX WW. Made in Europe by Michelin.
1” whitewalls look fantastic (if you’re into that). Smooth ride.
Expensive. 😩
Thanks Lucas Classic Tires in Long Beach for excellent service and rapid shipping.

Sat Jan 08, 2022 3:51 pm

Probably marked made in Europe.....I bet not France as originally. Is this the one that is actually made in Serbia at about $200 bucks a pop?

Sat Jan 08, 2022 3:55 pm

wheel607 wrote: Probably marked made in Europe.....I bet not France as originally. Is this the one that is actually made in Serbia at about $200 bucks a pop?

Yes, Serbia.

Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:30 pm

$800 and they will last you the life of the car or you- maybe both. A good deal.

Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:19 pm

I likey the looks of that. I think I know what my next set of tires is going to be...

Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:19 pm

thats a nice looking tire