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Mon Sep 06, 2021 2:31 am

In looking for wheel cylinders for my 1965 Bug, on Amazon I came across a whole bunch of american sounding brand names with wheel cylinders for my car. Names such as ACDelco, Raybestos, Dorman, Centric Parts. I wonder what kind of quality these are, and if any are actually made in the USA.

If they are all chinese junk, what are the good quality European or Brasilian brands these days?

Mon Sep 06, 2021 3:17 am

I got a set from Amazon for my 67 when I needed them in a pinch and they weren’t correct. AC Delco parts. I went with Wolfsburg West and it was worth the wait.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 3:58 am

After checking some more it looks like all of the brands I mentioned are made in China. Amazon also has a Beck Arnley wheel cylinder made in Italy, that's a step upward. Wolfsburg West has German Ate's but are they really made in Germany?

Mon Sep 06, 2021 4:54 am

Oh yes definitely worth it.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 6:09 am

If you don’t know what to buy, I’d recommend buying from one of the ACVW vendors. Sites like Jbugs, CIP1, Wolfsburg West all allow you to input the year make and model of your vehicle so you shop the correct parts. Once you find the correct parts, then try shopping Amazon with the right part numbers. With things like brake cylinders, you usually get 3 choices. Ones made in China, ones made in Brazil and ones made in Germany. The parts are usually priced accordingly.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 7:52 am

Wheel cylinder technology is pretty simple, and is almost 100 years old.

Shoot me, but I have some Autozone wheel cylinders in both my 1970 and 1971 VWs, and have not have any issues.

My 1970 sedan has a new/2016 Brazilian master cylinder, and my 1971 Super has a free replacement rebuilt master cylinder from Autozone to replace the lifetime-warrantied one I bought 2 decades ago.

My own feelings is that most of the brake issues folks on this site have are due to installation issues due to lack of experience/mechanical know how....

Mon Sep 06, 2021 8:10 am

Hi Custer, you are correct on most points but I believe the issue here is the quality of the vendor, not the part. Amazon sold me a set of 67 front wheel cylinders. The fit onto the backing plate but we’re larger than the original ones for the bug. If you can’t find one at a FLAPS then you are better off with a known good vendor.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 8:48 am

jbclem wrote: After checking some more it looks like all of the brands I mentioned are made in China. Amazon also has a Beck Arnley wheel cylinder made in Italy, that's a step upward. Wolfsburg West has German Ate's but are they really made in Germany?

If you’re dead set against using things from China, and stuck on German components, get out of the hobby.

Few are willing to pay for “quality”, so companies make what they sell. The shop I used to work at would have Brazilian/German cylinders on the shelf for months while they sold hundreds of the Chinese cylinders at 30%-50% the cost. Any of the Chinese Empi stuff I personally installed never had an issue.

There isn’t any aftermarket manufacture that’s the quality of an OEM VW part. You get people wanting quality parts that “last”, when in reality, the little they drive their fair weather classic car contributes to the failure of the components from inactivity.

Covid will ultimately destroy a lot of components for classic cars. With limitations on what will be made, items will be further scrutinized on if they are worth the time/money to make. Don’t be surprised if the higher end, fewer sold components are discontinued all together.

As for brake components, imo Ate, and FTE are at the top of the list. The last Ate stuff I installed was made in Italy, not Germany. The Brazilian Varga/TRW next, then the rest.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 11:07 am

Pops67Beetle wrote: Hi Custer, you are correct on most points

It's Cusser, not Custer.

Custer was the guy who invented the Arrow Shirt

Mon Sep 06, 2021 11:12 am

Sorry about that the damn iPad spell checker is my nemesis!

Mon Sep 06, 2021 12:03 pm

Actually, George Custer is credited with saving the nation during the Civil War, at Gettysburg.
https://truewestmagazine.com/article/custer-saved-the-nation/

Mon Sep 06, 2021 1:00 pm

[email protected] wrote: jbclem wrote: After checking some more it looks like all of the brands I mentioned are made in China. Amazon also has a Beck Arnley wheel cylinder made in Italy, that's a step upward. Wolfsburg West has German Ate's but are they really made in Germany?

If you’re dead set against using things from China, and stuck on German components, get out of the hobby.

Few are willing to pay for “quality”, so companies make what they sell. The shop I used to work at would have Brazilian/German cylinders on the shelf for months while they sold hundreds of the Chinese cylinders at 30%-50% the cost. Any of the Chinese Empi stuff I personally installed never had an issue.

There isn’t any aftermarket manufacture that’s the quality of an OEM VW part. You get people wanting quality parts that “last”, when in reality, the little they drive their fair weather classic car contributes to the failure of the components from inactivity.

Covid will ultimately destroy a lot of components for classic cars. With limitations on what will be made, items will be further scrutinized on if they are worth the time/money to make. Don’t be surprised if the higher end, fewer sold components are discontinued all together.

As for brake components, imo Ate, and FTE are at the top of the list. The last Ate stuff I installed was made in Italy, not Germany. The Brazilian Varga/TRW next, then the rest.

I also work at a parts supplier for hist. VW and have to agree. It's that sad.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 3:30 pm

We usually look for German, ATE only, but when we had the Zwitter, I bought a good supply of Raybestos (on sale, from the local break place)- still have several, even though the car is history - NOT Chinese junk either - USA parts - always keep a set of brake spares, on hand - usually look and buy (at a good price) from thesamba classifieds - have lotza' fast-moving parts - z

Mon Sep 06, 2021 4:00 pm

ZENVWDRIVER wrote: We usually look for German, ATE only, but when we had the Zwitter, I bought a good supply of Raybestos
My own 1970 has two rear drums purchased from RockAuto as Raybestos Premium (in 2017), and when these arrived the drums were stamped "made in Germany".

Mon Sep 06, 2021 4:29 pm

Well I purchased some rear wheel cylinders for my Squareback from Orielly's Auto. Still working fine, now the rear drums from Rock Auto were not concetric but out of round reall bad. So no more rock auto purchases for me.

Mon Sep 06, 2021 7:27 pm

There is a movement around the world in every market sector.

ABC. Not American Broadcasting Company but Anywhere But China

They have managed to copy people's intellectual property and sold it back to us with no penalty.

They have managed to sell things so cheaply that they have shut down industry in many countries. The stupid thing is that the average Joe keeps buying the cheap Chinese items and then complain that their company is shutting down and moving off shore.

The vendors are complicit in this. They are generally NOT willing to tell you where it is made and keep peddling the same rubbish.

Vote with your feet. Look for and buy products that are manufactured and sold with a sense of morality, fair play and complying with laws of our countries.

Tue Sep 07, 2021 1:19 pm

You get good results with all aftermarket brands if you BLEED YOUR BRAKES ON A REGULAR BASIS with fresh fluid. Say every 2-3 years. You let 'em sit for years on end they all will start leaking - and yes the German one will leak just the same.
Ask me how I know.

Dave

Tue Sep 07, 2021 3:31 pm

dcheek wrote: You get good results with all aftermarket brands if you BLEED YOUR BRAKES ON A REGULAR BASIS with fresh fluid. Say every 2-3 years. You let 'em sit for years on end they all will start leaking - and yes the German one will leak just the same. Ask me how I know.
Dave

My 1998 Frontier and my 2004 Frontier (260K and 106K) are still on their factory brake fluid, and factory clutch fluid on the 2004 as well. They both have their factory discs/calipers in front and drums/wheel cylinders in the rear. I have replaced brake pads and brake shoes on them. However, I'm in Arizona, and a more humid climate may need fluid changes.

Tue Sep 07, 2021 8:34 pm

My 2004 Tacoma also has all the original brake fluid in the brakes and clutch systems too. It lives in western Washington, rather known for rain. The pads and shoes are original as it has just under 65,000 miles on it.

The VW is filled with purple silicone brake fluid, DOT 5.0. It shouldn't need regular purging as it does not absorb moisture. You should replace all the rubber in your brake system if you wish to make that switch. You must only use DOT 5.0 after the switch, everything pre 5.0, and higher 5.x brake fluid versions, are incompatible. I have the MIL spec warning sticker on my car by the brake reservoir.

I try to buy and use Varga (Brazil) brake parts for my VWs when possible. I generally get them from one of the VW specialty shops. If they don't advertise the brand I ask. I try to find good used original drums to turn, but that is getting hard now.

Wed Sep 08, 2021 7:29 am

I need to add that whenever I do ANY hydraulic repair on any of my vehicles' brakes or hydraulic clutches, I ALWAYS flush the old fluid out of the system and replace with new.

But for most of us, that's just obvious and logical.