TheSamba.com :: View topic - any review/thoughts/experience with Carolina Dune Buggy Cages?

Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:58 pm

I'm starting a build of a manx clone, that will see mostly street use and some autocross (not enough offroad and beach cruising around me).

Does anyone have experience with the cages from Carolina Dune Buggies, specifically the "Show Bar/Show Cage 4pt Knock Down Kit"?

https://carolinadunebuggies.com/xcart5/roll_bar_show_cage_4pt_knock_down_ki.html?category_id=17

It seems like a reasonable price, but wondering if it'll provide adequate protection since it's labeled "show". Waiting to hear back what it's made out of.

Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:05 pm

Its is not designed for ANY real protection. It is purely show.

I have never used their product but it looks like the one I used from Hawkeye Buggies back in the day.

I thought it looked great in my Manx.

Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:31 pm

There is a reason it is called a "Show Bar". Most are made of 1 1/2" X .095" tubing. No, in my opinion it is not safe for any kind of meaningful life protection. If you are going to do any kind of racing get the rulebook for the sanction you are racing.

NHRA drag racing requires 1 5/8" x .120" DOM mild steel tubing.

Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:31 am

Even if built to roll cage specs it’s still a roll cage not an impact cage.

AMAC

Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:13 am

And there are several bars missing from design... Bar behind seat for seat belt anchor or height retension, rear bracing from rear hoop down to chassis, side bars from front to rear hoops at "door" (slide over tub edge) level, brace across front hoop at lower dash level....

Nothing worse than spending money on cage and getting to track event and having tech inspector telling you, cage does not pass tech inspection....

And what are your welding skills.... Do you trust your welds in case of a "undesireable event"....

Dale

Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:07 am

Heard back it's .098" Internally Welded Steel.

My welding skills are passable, but don't have a tube bender.

Glad I looked, "Roll bars of an ICSCC approved design are required in all homebuilt cars for Autocrosses" Now I need to figure out what that means. Looking at the ICSCC rules (https://www.icscc.com/references/comp_regs_2017.pdf) it doesn't talk about thickness and construction.

The SCCA rules from August seem suggest cars up to 1700lbs can use 1.375 x .080 "Seamless or DOM mild steel tubing (SAE 1020 or 1025 recommended) or alloy steel tubing (SAE
4130 or T45) , or Docol R8 tubing" (pg 88 https://www.scca.com/downloads/41806-gcr-august-2018)

Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:28 am

I notice you're in Canada. Quit using American rules, they aren't the same. You need to follow the WCMA rule book if you are in Western Canada. Not sure about east of Manitoba. Buggies fall into the Modified classes. You will need 1 5/8" .120 wall mild steel or 1 5/8" .095 chromoly. No alloy cages permitted.

brad

Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:49 am

slalombuggy wrote: I notice you're in Canada. Quit using American rules, they aren't the same. You need to follow the WCMA rule book if you are in Western Canada. Not sure about east of Manitoba. Buggies fall into the Modified classes. You will need 1 5/8" .120 wall mild steel or 1 5/8" .095 chromoly. No alloy cages permitted.

brad

I'm on south Vancouver Island, was looking at the rules for http://victoriamotorsports.ca/ which runs most of the the autocross that I've been too.

Where did you see those specs? Looking through the WCMA rules book, it's similar to the SCAA, cars up to 1700lbs can use 1.375 x .080 (pg. 67, http://www.wcma.ca/new/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/2018-WCMA-Technical-Regulations-02012018.pdf), I think I'm reading it right, and a finished buggy should be under 1700lbs.

Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:30 am

What you must consider is what it takes to save you in a city street or highway accident with a 5000 Lb. SUV or Dully Pick-up truck.

Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:32 am

What you must consider is what it takes to save you in a city street or highway accident with a 5000 Lb. SUV or Dully Pick-up truck.

Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:32 am

Quote: What you must consider is what it takes to save you in a city street or highway accident with a 5000 Lb. SUV or Dully Pick-up truck.

Sheer luck?

Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:10 pm

Not sure thinking about roll cages for the street safety is ideal, a minor crash could lead to smacking your head pretty good. Plus most new subcompacts wouldn't fair well against a 5000lb semi either. Not to mention my vanagon, I'm in front of the axle, the thought of a head on collision in that is terrifying. Need to be alert.

Need to think what that 40 or 50lbs of thicker tuber will add in seconds around a slalom course.

Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:44 pm

If you ever want to race outside of BC in Canada you need to build it out of at least 1.5" .120 wall tubing. Going to a lighter material isn't going to save as much weight as you think.

You can also build your buggy too light. I raced with a #120 brick of lead bolted to the front bumper of my tube chassis car. And that was after I melted another #50 into the front tubes of the chassis. You will do better reducing unsprung weight at the wheels and brakes, than scrimping on a strong roll cage.

brad

Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:37 am

vwracerdave wrote: What you must consider is what it takes to save you in a city street or highway accident with a 5000 Lb. SUV or Dully Pick-up truck.

If you are concerned about that you are in the wrong vehicle altogether! Sell it and buy something that comes crash tested from the factory with air bags and crush zones. You will NEVER make a fiberglass toy car crashworthy.

Even with the factory cars there are transport trucks that will take you out big time!

Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:57 am

slalombuggy wrote: If you ever want to race outside of BC in Canada you need to build it out of at least 1.5" .120 wall tubing. Going to a lighter material isn't going to save as much weight as you think.

You can also build your buggy too light. I raced with a #120 brick of lead bolted to the front bumper of my tube chassis car. And that was after I melted another #50 into the front tubes of the chassis. You will do better reducing unsprung weight at the wheels and brakes, than scrimping on a strong roll cage.

brad

Yikes, there's gotta be a better way! But I guess the weight distribution is very rearward.

Looking at picking up a pipe bender.

Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:45 am

There is a huge difference between a tubing bender and a pipe bender. You can not use pipe for a roll cage. You must use tubing.

Tue Aug 21, 2018 7:07 pm

A set of cage plans...

http://www.vdubn.com/dunebuggys/Manx/rollcage/rollcageindex.htm

Bryan

Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:01 am

vwracerdave wrote: There is a huge difference between a tubing bender and a pipe bender. You can not use pipe for a roll cage. You must use tubing.

Realizing that now, even though a lot of the pipe benders are advertised as pipe/tube benders. Even seen a few mentioning roll cages.

But looking at this style, https://www.kmstools.com/magnum-hydraulic-tubing-bender-97610

Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:23 pm

To give you an idea weight wise . My own chassis 1.625 .120 wall dom.
Car weighs 1400lbs wet no driver. Super thick fiberglass, steel wheels.

Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:06 am

What exhaust is that? They seem scarce for type lV motors....

Paul