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Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:29 am

I need to buy axles for my three rib conversion into a 70 baja. Can anyone confirm I am getting the correct length axles? For now, I'm going to use type 1 outer cv's and type 2 inner cv's. I will be mounting it with the 10 degree kit. I think I need 15 5/8" long axles?

Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:07 am

You are better off getting it all mocked up and measuring yourself. Sometimes you'll need different lengths, unless you offset trans a little.
Besides, we don't know what trailing arms you're using...
I was able to use stock type 2 axles with my 002 trans and 2x3 trailing arms.

Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:16 am

Yes. No one can tell you for sure. Measure measure measure

Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:19 am

The 15 5/8" where what they sold with the solid mount kit for the Bus into Bug.
Depending on what you have done with your suspension they may be to short.
I had that problem (on a buggy many years ago) when trying to get more travel downward with Bus CVs, the axle would not allow it.
Like has been said, mock it up to see what axle length you need before buying axles.

Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:36 pm

I've measured for drive shafts before, but I've never measured anything with CV's. How do I get an accurate measurement?

Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:05 pm

Raise trailing up for stub axle CV flange is even height with CV flange on trans.
Measure inside of cup to inside of cup on each flange and subtract 3/8-1/2" for axle length.
You want to be able to move axle in and out a little when suspension it at full extension.
Another idea is letting suspension to drop to where CVs start binding and then raise up 1/2in to set lower stop.

Mon Jan 19, 2015 3:26 pm

We just did the same swap on my friends baja this weekend. He has stock type 1 suspension. His measurements are 17" on driver and 16-7/8" on pasanger. The type 1 shaft had a slight bit of wiggle room at full compression on the driver side, but none on the passenger.

How much clearance is safe?

I know this shaft won't work for the passenger side, but I wonder if it's ok on the driver side. Seamed to have about 1/8" play max assembled.

Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:49 pm

Not having enough axle movement with stock axle is a good way to break CV cages.
Yes not centering the trans can lead to need to different axle lengths.
Safest way to go would be the 15 5/8" axles that do not have a stop on the inner splines.
Sometimes you can use the longer 16 1/4" aftermarket axles without the stop on the splines depending on how trans is mounted.
And something you can do with the aftermarket axle you can shorten them some as the spline areas are longer. I had to do it and recut the groove for the snap ring/spiral lock. You can use a cut off wheel to recut the groove.

Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:18 am

If my measurements are about 17", don't I need axles aroung 16.5"? I thought I read to measure from level cup to cup, then subtract 3/8" - 1/2" for needed axle length.

Wouldn't having 15-5/8" axles be too short and pull the shaft from the CV or pull on the CV itself if clipped with snap ring?

When I mentioned having little play on the shaft at full compression, I'm under the inpression that it is where the splines stop (the shoulder on the shaft) that is causing the tightness since the shafts are shorter than the measured cups. Would I be better off with 16-1/8" (or maybe even 16-3/4") shafts with the longer splines? I would think the longer splines would eliminate binding as the CV's could float down the splines when needed.

Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:06 am

Stock axles with the inner stop on axle splines don't allow for enough movement which sounds like what you are feeling.
Please remind me of the CVs joints and trailing arms you are using.
What kind of wheel travel are you trying to get?
Bus trans into Bug you can use the aftermarket 16 1/4" long axles.
I recommend using Bus size (100mm) CV joints on both inner and outer. Using a Bug size CV limits amount of angle you can get.
Make sure to have loose fitting CV joints as they will allow for move angle and travel. It fairly easy to make the CV fit looser by using sanding rolls on a die grinder and polishing the ball races on inner and outer parts of CV joint and the stock cages. If you have Bus CVs, I recommend using the Empi chromoly cages, they are not that expensive and don't break like stock ones.
The measurement of axles can be fudge a little when trying to find a ready made axle vs. having a custom one made.
After market axles that do not have the stops on splines and have longer splines can be shorten some to make fit.
You can shorten them at home with a cut off wheel being careful and recut a new groove for the snap ring/ spiral lock.
On one of my own projects I using 16 1/4" Empi axles where I should be using something a little longer with the way it set up. I lengthen stock trailing arms 2in and have very loose fitting type II CV joints with Empi chromoly cages. Trans is a 002 Bus. It has 11 1/2" of usable travel. At full droop you can still feel the axle moving in the splines.

Another buggy I have has a type II trans and 3x3 arms, 19 1/4" axle with 930 Empi Race CVs. I got tired of hearing the knocking of the axle hitting the cup area of the stub axle while driving on the street. I cut the axle a little shorter so they would not contact the cup at the ride height I am at. By doing this, I did limit the amount of wheel travel I could get. Now the axle stops moving in and out before the CVs start binding. It has 13in of wheel travel.

The stock axle if used do not have any margin of safety for the CV. With the stop on the inner spline, if something happens to move trailing arm inward (such as sliding into a tree), CVs travel the distance they can internally and with them being fixed on the axle splines, something has to give and it is the CV ball cage being broken apart. This happen to me.

Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:31 am

My freind and I both have stock beetle trailing arms with double spring plates. The inner plate is notched about 1/2". I don't know the full travel, but we aren't going for anything extreme. I'd guess we will have about 9" or so of travel. 3 rib with 10 degree kit.

As far as CV's, we want to use what we have for now which is why we are going type 1 outers and type 2 inners. Otherwise, we would have to spring for more cv's and stub axles along with new axles. Money and time we don't have right now. We can always upgrade later when our budgets permit.

I've found some 16-1/4" aftermarket axles for sale for a reasonable price. If I find some 16-3/4" aftermarket axles on the cheap, I think I should go this route and have them sortened a touch and snap ring grooves added. I can have a coworker do this for free on a lathe.

Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:56 am

To make the CVs you have work better if you have not done it, is to make the CVs move more freely and by doing you can get a little more angle out of them.
It also helps with the amount the CV center star can travel past the edge of the outer race.
If the CV can move a little more, using a shorter axle can be done with in reason.
Try and center the trans so axle length is equal on each side. You may have to oblong the frame horn mounting bolt holes. Nose cone will be a little off center, but there is enough flexibility in linkage it will work.

Use the 16 1/4in axles, I think they will work fine for you. The biggest limiter is the use of a Bug CV joint.

Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:09 pm

Here is what I have on both Bug and streetrail.
Bus 3 rib trans, Porsche 944 stubs, Axle, CVs.
Make sure you center the trans by measuring the flange to flange, NOT the center of the case. Everything bolts up without any fabrication. Look on craigslist for somebody parting out a early 944. You should get the parts cheeper than a new set of axles.

Check out blind chicken
http://blindchickenracing.com/How_to/CVJoints_Axles/axles_101.htm
http://blindchickenracing.com/How_to/CVJoints_Axles/cv_joints_101.htm

DWP

Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:45 am

Do the 944 cv's allow for the axle to plunge deeper into the cups? The issue I have is the CV's are maxed out at full compression. Aftermarket axles don't have the shoulder allowing the axle to move depper through the CV hub. The 944 axles have shoulders just like the vw axles. So unless the 944 cv's have lots more lateral motion, I'd think I would have the same result.

It looks like I can get the thing stubs and 944 assemblies for around $200 which is comparable to new axles. I had found some used axles for $60, but I'm letting my freind use those. I may end up going 944. idk.

Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:08 am

The 944 porsche axles are shorter than the stock axles. On my rail I can move my axles in and out with the flanges in a straight line.
Just make sure the trans is centered using the flanges to outer flange.
I had the grind out the trans mount to move it over about 1/2

DWP

Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:13 am

Some of the 944 stub axles look right like the ones below,

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-944-Stub-Axles-198...mp;vxp=mtr

But some are short like these.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/EXCELLENT-USED-ORIGINAL-GE...mp;vxp=mtr

I know I need the longer one, but it makes me wonder about the axles.

Are all 944 axles the same or do the automatics have different axles then the 5 speeds? What about year? Some say they are for 83-85, then some say 85.5 to 87.

What is the difference between 930 and 944?

Man I'm confused. Anyone know more about the 944's? and is e-bay going to be my best source? There is a guy on the samba with everything for $200, but it says there is slight wear on the CV's. Makes me wonder if the CV's are not going to last long. It's an older add, but maybe he still has them.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1692891

Wed Jan 28, 2015 11:17 am

The first ebay picture,
Early 924,944, and VW Thing. ALittle wear should not be a problem considering you are buying them used.

The ebay price seems high to me.
Keep looking on craigslist for somebody parting out a 944. By the way the trailing arms on a early 944 are the same as a vw.

930 cv are different size and bolt pattern.
Check the blindchicken web site

DWP