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Mon May 09, 2011 8:59 pm

Is this the best way of cooling, the owner of my bug before me installed one but it does not have these attached http://www.jbugs.com/product/8884.html?Category_Code=vw-doghouses-styles-fans-shrouds

It doesn't have the hole in the tin cut for it, would cutting the tin and installing those pieces keep my engine cool enough, or should I change the oil cooler to another place and get a bigger one? I haven't cut the whole back off my Baja yet and I'm not sure I will

Mon May 09, 2011 9:25 pm

Driftmonkeyok wrote:
It doesn't have the hole in the tin cut for it, would cutting the tin and installing those pieces keep my engine cool enough
those tins are for the dog house style fan shrouds and are not needed.
if its not a doghouse style dont cut it!

Mon May 09, 2011 10:00 pm

It has the dog house shroud without those pieces attached

Tue May 10, 2011 10:19 am

Is it a Baja or does it have a closed engine bay? if it is closed you need those pieces plus the correct tin that seals the flywheel side of the engine compartment that directs the hot out of the shroud and under the car.

Casey

Tue May 10, 2011 1:47 pm

Since the car is not cut up (yet :wink: ), and you say that the dog house tins are in place, I'm guessing that you don't have this...

http://www.jbugs.com/product/8952.html?Category_Code=vw-front-engines-tins

Like Casey said, you'll need all of the tin and seals to keep the hot air from coming back inside the engine compartment.

Tue May 10, 2011 2:25 pm

First, make sure you are sure of what you have. There are two different type of type 1 fan shrouds. The dog house fan shround is used for the blocks that have the oil cooler sitting a few inches further towards the back (as in torwards the front of car) of the engine case. If you have a dog house with out the pieces you mentioned, you should be able to see one side of the oil cooler.

Tue May 10, 2011 3:45 pm

Surf is correct, I'll post a picture of what it looks like in a little bit

Tue May 10, 2011 8:14 pm

Quote: Surf is correct

Cool. What do I win? :)

You may be able to put one in place without removing the engine, but you'll have to get creative.
Just realized as I was going over what would have to be done in my head, that you may not have the lower sleds either. They bolt to the front tin and the cylinder tin.

Wed May 11, 2011 6:29 am

Would it be simpler to just remove the oil cooler that's on there and put on an aftermarket bigger one?

Wed May 11, 2011 7:33 am

Driftmonkeyok wrote: Would it be simpler to just remove the oil cooler that's on there and put on an aftermarket bigger one?

Unless you are running a lot larger than stock engine with higher compression than stock, a aftermarket cooler will not work as well as the stock VW oil cooler unless you put some elaborate cooling fans on the cooler and keep the cooler away from the engine cooling fan inlet. Plus, a couple of tins are much cheaper than a aftermarket cooler.

I am currently running a 2165 cc engine with 8.1:1 compression (higher than stock) with dual carbs and the stock doghouse cooler has done just fine keeping the engine cool even on long grades at speed in my Single Cab lifted bus running TSL Super Swamper tires.

Wed May 11, 2011 1:17 pm

intersting thread.

i have wondered myself weather i switch to an aftermarket cooler to replace the stock or switch to doghouse since i have the old style 36hp cooling on my stock 1600sp. (would love the raise the compression!)

Wed May 11, 2011 2:06 pm

Jake Raby spent A LOT of money researching the cooling on the T1 engine before moving onto the T4 engines. He complied a massive amount of data on which fan shrouds, which tins, which coolers, which fans, compression, vains, foil, ducts, venturi rings, thermostats and more.

His research showed that the VW engineers really did know what they were doing when they designed the cooling system on the T1 engine. For $ 500 plus, it could be improved with the DTM (Down The Middle) fan shroud. But the best system still is the stock dog house fan shroud with the stock dog house oil cooler AND ALL the factory tins installed.

The worst fan shrouds are as follows with the worst first:
Center mount with separate oil cooler
offset mount, angle flowed with separate oil cooler
36 horse aftermarket with separate oil cooler
36 horse aftermarket with dog house cooler in stock location

The aftermarket cylinder tins are a joke. They do not include the air foil that splits the cooling air over the spark plugs.

The cooltin or "super cool" tins from a T3 were also proven not to help the upright T1, but actually hurt the cooling.

The front breast plate (front of the engine is the flywheel end) is needed even in a baja to help isolate the dog house hot air from being sucked back into the cooling fan.

A lot of people will say "my buddy ran his for ever with the angle flow shroud and almost nothing else for 15 years and it never hurt anything" or they have torn down hundreds of engines and the missing tin never hurt anything. Not good data from bubba over in the next hollow.

Jake Raby's data was hard data gathered in a scientific approach, documented with flow meters, multiple heat pickups and thousands of hours on test stands checking out anything he could buy, borrow or make.

May not look pretty, but the old stock stuff is the best. After reading his data several years ago, I started buying all the stock dual port, doghouse based tin I find and storeing it in the top of my garage for future use when none is avaliable. I now have enough to build at least 10 engines complete.

Wed May 11, 2011 10:16 pm

Ok I'm not sure what missing does anyone have a poc of behind the shroud and what it should look like with the dog house

Thu May 12, 2011 8:58 am

You do not need # 14 or # 15, they are for older freash air style cooling.

Thu May 12, 2011 12:34 pm

Silly poster! That is a bus! No, really. Totally screwed me up. So that is a picture taken from the point of view of "Driver side of bus is missing, you are looking in at the motor from there"?

Thu May 12, 2011 12:41 pm

twomonkeysayoyo wrote: Silly poster! That is a bus! No, really. Totally screwed me up. So that is a picture taken from the point of view of "Driver side of bus is missing, you are looking in at the motor from there"?

Yep, that is a bus the engine is installed in, from the drivers side looking at the dog house tins. Not my bus. My bus does not have the fuel tank in the engine compartment, (Single Cabs have them forward of the engine compartment accessed through the treasure chest).

Those are all posted photos / drawings found in the Gallery with a quick search titled "engine tin".

Search is our friend.