TheSamba.com :: View topic - Paint

Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:55 am

Wow. Only two months.

Very sorry man.

But--youre healing and you'll be a better man for it. Not sure why it happened, but I know everything happens for a reason.

Once again. Beautiful cars--sweet pinstriping.

Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:34 am

I really love doing artwork on cars. more so than painting them for sure. So to me there is nothing better than seeing it buryed under a few coats of clear. Thats not easy to do over pinstripe because they are pretty thick.

Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:28 pm

Is single stage easier or harder to spray than BC/CC for a beginner. Does paint gun choice matter between spraying either one. I plan on painting the car black.

Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:40 pm

single is way easier,you just have to absolutly make sure all impurities are taken off the panels...single stage has a tendency to fish eye worse than base/clear... it has less reducer, so flashes alot longer than say base, two light coats of base kick faster than 1 med coat of single...

single stage doesn't like drop coats and light coverage as does base...so clean the snot out of the panels...put a adhesion coat down first (light coat for adhesion,this let's you know if the panel has good adhesion and no impurities)...then a med coat followed by a good 3rd coat (between med to full wet).

let it flash between all coats it VERY important with single as there is way more solevents, like hardeners and reducers to "air" out before the following coats

hope this helps!!!

Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:34 pm

Ya think Shell? I think base/clear is easier. I also feel it is more forgiving to a novice.
I would think you will get better results with both if you use a conventional/compliant gun rather than an HVLP gun.

Mon Feb 21, 2011 7:21 am

What are your thoughts of clear coating a single stage paint? I'm using PPG's Concept, and I've found it to be a little "soft" after it's dried (I used it on a VW Thing before). I'm looking at spraying PPG's Strato-clear over it, since you can't add it to the last coat (not compatable according to the product info sheet). That sheet does say it can be clear coated after waiting 2 hrs (air dry). Thanks.

Mon Feb 21, 2011 8:04 am

Bobnotch wrote: What are your thoughts of clear coating a single stage paint? I'm using PPG's Concept, and I've found it to be a little "soft" after it's dried (I used it on a VW Thing before). I'm looking at spraying PPG's Strato-clear over it, since you can't add it to the last coat (not compatable according to the product info sheet). That sheet does say it can be clear coated after waiting 2 hrs (air dry). Thanks. If its a solid color....i say give it a try.....or maybe do one fender and make sure there is not a reaction first.

Mon Feb 21, 2011 9:15 am

If the Tech sheet says you can do it and gives the proper flash times I'm sure you'll be ok. PPG is a good company and if youngollow their specs you shouldn't get any problems.

Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:36 am

yep clear coated over concept and single on a baja bug,solid blue...but lik Tony said...you should always read the tech sheets or reference manual before doing so.

Mon Feb 21, 2011 9:38 pm

Thanks guys. I thought I'd be ok, but just wanted to be sure. It does give flash times and all the other info you need. I haven't seen a reaction in my test samples either, so I think I'm good to go. By the way, this top coating is going over PPG's other primers (DP series, and K-36), so they should be "compatable". :wink:

Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:01 am

perfect,but just in case do one area on it's own first say a glove box door separate make sure nothing lifts,kicks,dye back etc.....then go for it.

Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:23 am

holy crap @ the agave car, is this the car you were in?

The paint really did wear like iron though!

How much is u-tech compared to other products? I am torn on to which system to use. It's between PPG DCC Concept SS, and Glasurit Line 22.

Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:17 pm

schell; What is the advantage of 'mixing' in clear on the final go vs just spraying clear over single stage?

I will be painting my 23 Window, but it's a little too huge to BC/CC, so I plan to single stage it and the for extra shine, clear coat just the outside.

Good idea or not?

Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:27 pm

Man im sure that adding clear to the last coat of SS makes them look great, but I sprayed a quarterpanel (repair job) yesterday with some Chromabase and followed it with 4 coats of the Sherwin clear, let it sit over night and some time out in the sun....a quick 1500-2000-3000 wetsand and then polish...and man does it look slick. It was that Hemi sunburst orange pearl and looks 3 feet deep... and was EASY!! BC/CC rules man!

Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:37 pm

I would rather do BC/CC, but that is ALOT of surface area! Try painting 3 bugs in a row, inside out and that's basically what you are dealing with a bus.

I might try it in stages, do the cabin, rear area, roof, sides. (I still have to paint the bottom!!).

:)

Tue Feb 22, 2011 7:50 pm

Yeah thats true! I was just dicussing that very thing with a guy today that wants an enclosed trailer painted. But he wants some artwork on it, so i may just go ahead and base it, spray a coat of clear on, do the art, then add a few more coats of clear. He wants a huge freekin waving USA flag on each side. Poney up mofo$$ Nothing better than laying fineline tape over 10,000 rivits and not let any of them bleed. UGH! I picked a bad week to stop sniffing glue.

Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:11 pm

again...you CAN NOT mix clear into METALFLAKE single that's just foolish...to get more depth out of flake..bc/cc ,no brainer for christ sake.

for show quality: simply clear coat with 2 wet,sand and flow coat with 2 more wet ,sand to 2-3k and it's super deep..just 2 regular clear coats is factory.

SOLIDS benefit from mix clear into last coat..this has been proven especially in black..period

..I've said this 100 times...bc/cc is way more acceptable in flake,transfer,user ability,blending,matching etc. this is why they use it in collision...but when spraying solid colors, single is cheaper in the long run for the smaller budget guy and honestly that's this hobby and we all know it.

I can post a 100 different photos of clear coat jobs that look insane that are not on my web addy as they are not vw's and we try not to clutter the site with to many "other" brands,only good friends cars...BC/CC will always be king...spend 6k in wets and spend 100hrs cutting and buffing added to a 600hrs body labor, then can your really appreciate a true bc/cc job...and it wouldn't make much sense to put single stage flake on it right?....ain't no vw gonna go into a 30k paint job, i can tell you that!!

that's why alot of guys prefer the single over the clears when it comes to a factory look,cheap materials and ease of spraying...keeps thee cost down but they still get a bad ass paint job...so everybody wins...but the metal flake vw's still get bc/cc

GLH turbo: Utech is very limited when asked to make a code...i had a mixing bank and a colormap book so I was able to make any color I wanted regardless. as far as other i would recommend PPG or the Glasurit in their single line..but glasurit is very expensive

that trrailer's gonna be diesel expensive in materials...why doesn;'t he just wrap it?...that mural is gonna kill you...hope he's paying you well!!!

Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:21 pm

So, why do you mix clear in single stage instead of just spraying it on top? :)

Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:30 pm

^^ :wink: ...because your not using the same amount of clear over the entire car...it is added to enhance gloss like the on "enhancers" that used to be available...if your gonna put clear over the entire car you might as well use bc/cc.

you buy a gallon of base,chances are your gonna cover the car with a gallon of clear...you will also most likely have dry spots here and there as well since base has a tendancy to "powder" in poorly sanded areas,such as under side of package trays and inside lower trunk areas...where as single goes on wet and stays wet...by mixing clear in the last coat your adding more gloss and better ease of sanding and buffing.. plus it adds a ton more UV protection.

putting clear over it entirely after it has already flashed will make your single paint underneath dye back or solivent pop through the clear coat that was applied,as single dries slower than clear,mixing them together ties the hardeners and reducers together.

for example-1qt color:
-Utech black:
-3 parts color-1 part hardener-1 part reducer

clear coat:
-4 parts clear-1 part hardener
**you add only 20% of this clear mix to the above mixed qt in your last coat**

your already putting a last flow coat over the entire car anyways,so this is when you mix this ratio.

hope this helps guys and also sheds a little more light on something that has been done for 20yrs...once they stopped using enhancers and additives in singles and clears for extra gloss.(per order of the VOC's and EPA standards today)

Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:09 pm

Damnit thats it!! Im going to go get me a quart of black tomorrow and give er a try on that scooter. And just to recap...it will be ok to add clear over it if/when I decide to add some art correct? Provided they dont react of course.

And hey man i dont question it. If the dude wants his trailer painted...I will be glad too. He pays cash by the hour!! And really man.... what kind of painter even suggests wrap??!! Aint no class in wrap baby!!