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Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:55 am

I'm sure this has been done, but am unsure how to go about to a finding and installing the right Porsche 5 speed tranny to go into a VW.

I have a running '69 pan and a T4 2.0L core in the que for this year. This'll be a turbo EFI combo that is street driven only, possibly a day at the drag races just to see how it does. I'm aiming for 200-300HP.

I've started looking at Porsche 5 speeds. I know the older 912's had the T4 engine and would seem to be be an easy bolt up. Will these trans will hold up to this type of horspower?

How about the 911 trannys, how easy is it to install one of these? Will they hold up to this type of power?

Are there any others that you'd recommend?

Thanks in advance
Greg

Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:13 pm

www.aircooled.net has a great article about installing one of those in a bug.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:29 pm

Like it was mentioned aircooled.net has an article on the install process....

Something to think about but it can be done, is that the gear ratios are all off for doing something like this, something to keep in mind, but think Weddle can help you out there..

Also, don't forget, 911 can rip out a tranny just like a VW can rip up a VW tranny.. Also, something that can go are the CV's as well, some friends learned the hard way that even 911's are not blow proof...... This is of course if you are drag racing.... RB

Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:44 pm

The older 912's had 912 engines (see also 356). Don't quote me here..but I think only the '76 912e ha a type 4 engine. If you are looking to do an easy swap. then you need to make sure the trans you select doesn't have a round bell housing as there is no provision for the rear mount. Most Porsches rely on a rear hanger for support. I put a 912 (901)trans with a round bell housing in my car using custom rear mount that uses all 4 of the engine mount holes and stock vw rubber mounts. I had to raise it all one inch to get it to clear the frame horns.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:40 pm

Railboy is correct. All tranny's are designed for a specific engine. When I put my 914 T-4 in my bug all of a sudden I did not need first gear on level ground, the hp of the T-4 was enought to get me going . When it was a 55 hp engine you would need the gearing to move 4 adults. On the other end , 4 th gear, I went to a later model VW tranny the 73 and later. You no longer needed the lower 4th to get up a hill, the T-4 had the torque. I was doing 3000 rpms at 60 mph with old tranny, now I am doing the same rpm at 70. Much quieter and higher top speed.

My point obviously the porsche trannys are geared for a much more powerful engine and torque spec's. You may wind up with more pushing of gears and get worst performance. A waste of time and arm movement.

Now on to the 5 speed being needed!! Why, a 914 with my engine will do 125 to 130 mph and my bug weights 300 lbs so it is even faster. My bug with all the work I did to keep it on the ground, starts lifting at 90 mph. So actually the daily driver range is between 0 and 75. I wish I could get a taller 1st and then my 4 speed would be perfect.
Granted I can't say I have a Porsche 5 speed in my car.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:46 pm

If you are willing to do all that for a Porsche 5 Speed, including regearing, look into a Berg 5 Speed with Bus Box, that can do you up...... RB

Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:58 pm

http://www.cal-look.com/fitting-a-901-porsche-tranny-to-an-irs-beetle-chassis/

Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:01 pm

RailBoy wrote: If you are willing to do all that for a Porsche 5 Speed, including regearing, look into a Berg 5 Speed with Bus Box, that can do you up...... RB

at 8 times the price..... :twisted:

Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:48 pm

Think it depends on where you are getting this stuff and who does the work.... RB

Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:47 pm

The 901 trans is the easiest swap, which came from an early model 911 (I think up to about '72?) - Pretty sure this is the most often referenced Porsche "swap" trans. As mentioned, the 1976 912 was the only T4 engine 912 and used a "923 trans" - this seems to be the optimum one to get, but also pretty rare. Later 911 trans is stronger, but really geared wrong for a "torquey" T4 and more work to fit into a T1 chassis. More $$$ and more work.

The general favorite is the Type 901 (early 911) trans, but re-gerared with the 914 gearing (made for a T4). Be aware though, first gear rebuild is about $500 (and generally needed!), and a full rebuild can run over $2500 if any bearings are needed. Be sure to factor in some level of rebuild into your swap costs.

Bug@5 speed has all the conversion bits to make this swap easier:
http://www.germanlook.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=49

Maybe better yet, but still a little un-tried "en masse" is converting to a Suby WRX trans. A little crazy, but when the costs are added up it becomes a viable option:
http://www.members.iinet.net.au/~ttriebler/

Jeff

Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:13 pm

A rebuilt 912 5 speed trans for 2500 would be a steal :lol: I have a 67 912 with a sick trans and have been shopping a rebuild, the parts are expensive and the labor is as well.Show me a reputable trans shop who will do this for that price :.and i will be forever grateful :P

Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:48 pm

There's a Berg5 in the classifieds for $3800 at the moment, IRS too....

Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:57 pm

You can find a Berg 5 for as low as $1,800 that I have seen on here, but typically over the past few years around $2,500 Built and ready to be installed.... Both Bus Boxes as well as Bug Box.....

Here is a way to get to the nitty gritty though if money and time are not part of the scheme...

http://www.geneberg.com/cat.php?name=5%20Speed%20Kits&cPath=13

http://www.geneberg.com/cat.php?cPath=13_389

RB

Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:11 pm

RailBoy wrote: You can find a Berg 5 for as low as $1,800
The conversion parts alone cost that much.

Mine was about $2800 not counting the core, Rhino case and ZF LSD that I supplied.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:57 pm

Glenn wrote: RailBoy wrote: You can find a Berg 5 for as low as $1,800
The conversion parts alone cost that much.

Mine was about $2800 not counting the core, Rhino case and ZF LSD that I supplied.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1072598

That's about the going rate for a built Berg 5 Speed with close ratio gears. Add another $1000 for a 5 Speed Bus with a 4.13 R&P. If you can find complete close ratio Berg 5 Speeds for $1800, buy ten of them.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:19 pm

[email protected] wrote: Glenn wrote: RailBoy wrote: You can find a Berg 5 for as low as $1,800
The conversion parts alone cost that much.

Mine was about $2800 not counting the core, Rhino case and ZF LSD that I supplied.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1072598

That's about the going rate for a built Berg 5 Speed with close ratio gears. Add another $1000 for a 5 Speed Bus with a 4.13 R&P. If you can find complete close ratio Berg 5 Speeds for $1800, buy ten of them.
The Erco mainshaft is not a cheap part either.

Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:36 pm

Cptn. Calzone wrote: A rebuilt 912 5 speed trans for 2500 would be a steal :lol: I have a 67 912 with a sick trans and have been shopping a rebuild, the parts are expensive and the labor is as well.Show me a reputable trans shop who will do this for that price :.and i will be forever grateful :P

Send a note to the good doctor:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=56892

Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:34 am

Lots of good ideas here, thanks a bunch!

How about aftermarket 5spd trans. Is there such a thin besides the Berg?

What about a 911 trans, would a T4 bolt up to a 911 tranny without an adapter plate?

Sun Jan 16, 2011 1:46 pm

You can bolt a type 4 engine right up to a 911,912, or 914 transaxle, You'll need to use a 914 flywheel for the starter to engage right.
The 914 can be converted to rear engine configuration using a nose cone and shift rod from a 911/912 transaxle or using conversion parts from Bug@5 speed they have an excellent web site on the conversion.
Lots of diffrent gearing came/is available in the 901 style gear boxes, the 914 came geared for the type 4 engine.
Good Luck,

Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:51 pm

www.mendeolamotors.com ................spendy, but you won't blow it up :wink:

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