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Fri May 28, 2010 9:41 am

Andrew A. Libby wrote: morymob, the thread that wildenbeast linked is a build thread for my VNT install:

http://www.vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php?topic=21424.0

tozovr, all things are definitely relative to perspective. Off-boost performance and turbo lag are both dramatically worsened at 7,000ft of elevation and so I'm much more sensitive than those living at lower elevations. With the T3 or K24 I've had moderate inclines where I was stuck in second gear because even with the engine revved out I couldn't catch boost in the next gear shifting as fast as possible and without boost it couldn't accelerate. Even a short hill seems long when you're stuck in second gear and the speed limit is 40 or 50 mph. The smaller turbos never have that issue and the VNT is just gravy with boost at any operational rpm.

yeah I live on the coast :)

Morymob...be prepared to gape when you read up on that setup LOL

Fri May 28, 2010 9:57 am

[quote="Andrew A. Libby"]I'm here. Life is busy (but very fun).

My perspective on turbo sizing comes from living at 7,000ft and driving these wonderful heavy boxes. Austin, TX is at all of 500ft of elevation, so there is a considerable difference.

I have always found the lag of the K24s or T3s in a vanagon with a 1.6TD to be intolerable even when functioning properly and fitted with the proper LDA pump.

Andrew,
You're definitely right. That is what I was afraid of. Actually, I thought I would run into this issue before I installed the T3. I guess I would just give it a shot because it is what I had and it had the trapezoidal flange. Might you have any idea what the stock application might have been for a turbo like that? Could I be wrong, and it really be a T2? I suppose I am not so posotive the turbo is the T3 after all. It has an a/r .42 if that's any help.....

Fri May 28, 2010 10:06 am

The T3 and K24 were the turbos that were fitted to the 1.6TD when installed in the Rabbit, Golf, Jetta, Passat, Quantum and Audi. They were conspicuously never installed on the 1.6TD vanagon in other markets. It is interesting to me that VW went on to install smaller turbos on the larger displacement 1.9TD and TDI engines. It sure sounds like you have a T3, but post up a pic and I can tell you for sure.

Fri May 28, 2010 10:59 am

T3 and K26 turbos are stock for 3.0L Mercedes diesels, and my 2.5L has a T2, so yeah, I'd say they were a bit much for anything below 2.0L...unless you're adding more fuel via propane or larger plungers.

Fri May 28, 2010 11:17 am

Zeitgeist 13 wrote: T3 and K26 turbos are stock for 3.0L Mercedes diesels, and my 2.5L has a T2, so yeah, I'd say they were a bit much for anything below 2.0L...unless you're adding more fuel via propane or larger plungers.
The T3 turbos on Mercedes diesels had different A/R from the T3 that came stock on the VW 1.6TD. I believe the Benz had the .42, and the VW had a .36.

I had a Benz T3 on my 1.9 AAZ for a while, but the lag was punishing even at my sea-level location, and my injection pump could only heat it up to spool 10 psi of boost. When I swapped to a VW T3, I was pushing 18 psi with the same injection pump settings. Magic! Just what I wanted. (Wastegate hose capped off in both examples.)

Jack Bombay very kindly plotted the efficiency map of my 1.9 AAZ engine with the VW T3 turbo (.36 A/R) in this thread - scroll down about 2/3 of the way through the page:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3122870

Sat May 29, 2010 8:27 am

so... i guess my plan is to try to fit the tdi k03 into the vanagon. we'll see how that goes..

Sat May 29, 2010 8:41 am

Witless Joe wrote:
The T3 turbos on Mercedes diesels had different A/R from the T3 that came stock on the VW 1.6TD. I believe the Benz had the .42, and the VW had a .36.

Yeah, that makes more sense. The stock Garrett T3 on my OM603 had an A/R of .48 and I have a later model version sitting on a shelf with an A/R of .55

Sun May 30, 2010 10:23 am

so.... the wastegate interferes and the setup off of the passat won't really work without fabbing up an adapter plate. not really too into that. well.... the search begins for a k-14.... ](*,)

Mon May 31, 2010 8:54 am

looks like i found a k14. should be here wed.... :lol: everything should bolt up, right? oil return flange should be the same? i had a drain line fabbed to fit my 50* setup... any thing else i should expect?

Mon May 31, 2010 3:23 pm

Manifold to turbine and turbine to exhaust are the same. Compressor inlet is smaller. You can bush it. The compressor outlet to manifold is the same. The oil supply is the same. The oil return is different. It has a pipe that screws into the turbo rather than a flange that bolts on.

Wed Jun 02, 2010 12:46 pm

so... my k14 came in and everything seemed cool. i went to bolt it up and the wastegate is hitting the LH engine mount about 3/8" before being able to seat it! ](*,) what can i do. i am about to mount and plumb in my saab 900 intercooler, but i guess i want to know if i can delete the wastegate? i know what it does and yadda yadda yadda, but what i don't know is how much boost can the k14 make without being wastegated? i think my setup should be able to handle 18-20lbs. yargh! this is getting more interesting than i was hoping for.

calvalry, i need some backup!!

Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:11 pm

Which manifold are you using? Must be the jetta/golf style as it won't interfere with the Quantum/Vanagon style. Although, I'm perplexed that your T3 fit if you are using the Jetta manifold. Another request for a picture... You'll get better info if those giving it can see what you're dealing with. You could try to source the parts for using the Quantum/Vanagon manfifold, but I wouldn't (different can of worms). Instead I would do this:

Andrew A. Libby wrote: bludodger wrote: PS Any pics of your modified Bracket?

Here are a couple of pics. The first one is rotated to the installed angle if you were looking at the mounting bracket from under and in front (front of van) of it. As you can see the nose of the bracket was chopped off and spacers and a piece of steel was bolted to the bottom of it.

This one shows the inside of the bracket where the bolts go through and the additional pieces of metal used to distribute the force.

A spacer between the frame rail and the front of the engine carrier bar returns the engine to its original location. The spacer should be double the thickness of the metal used.

There isn't an easy way to remove the wastegate altogether.

Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:28 pm

you're right. i do need pics. problem is.... the t3 is gone already. i also forgot to mention that the engine bracket is custom made. i feel that is a big part of the problem. the guy who helped me with that made the t3 wastegate adjustable and designed the bar to barely clear it.

another thing, the wastgate is removable with 3 allen head screws. the question would be more about how to weld up the plunger.....

Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:33 pm

You'd have to weld up the valve seat hole and then bolt a plate to where the wastegate currently is. I would modify the bracket before doing that to the turbo.

Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:34 pm

well, i think i finally realized what the problem is. i have tried 2 turbos and they both hit right where the engine mount bolts to the engine bracket. i think the problem is the custom made engine bracket. i'm realizing that the engine is most likely tilted farther than 50*. so, in theory, if i was to tilt the engine farther to the pass side of the van, than i would get more clearance between the turbo and the engine mount. that seems reasonable and logical, yes?!?