TheSamba.com :: View topic - Pilot Bearing with RJES Bellhousing (3.3l Trouble Shooting)

Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:39 pm

Hey there... This is a repost from a UK forum in hopes that someone in the US might have experience with this area.

I have a Subaru Conversion that I had done with a RJES bellhousing kit. The engine mounts are from Small Car (Arghhh) and then the Vanagon is a 1986 syncro with the syncro 4 speed transmission, engine is a 3.3l out of a 92 svx.

Ok so long story short. After about 6-8k miles on the conversion the Pilot bearing basically fell apart which caused some input shaft movement and loosened up the input shaft seal.

Took it all apart and the pilot bearing was toast, the input shaft seal was not that bad but clutch pressure plate ect was soaked from the amount of fluid slinging around.

I had a new input shaft placed into the transmission, I went down and got a new 6002 pilot bearing and was ready to put it all back together again with a new clutch kit when I realized the amount of play in the pilot bearing seemed excessive.

The 6002 bearing has an interior diameter of about 14.91 mm and the problem is that input shafts greatly vary. I pulled about 10 different Input Shafts out of my mechanics supply and measured them all. They all were around 14.58 to 14.69 mm which allows for almost .2 MM of play which seems very very high and in some cases it could be up to .4 mm

Does anyone know what the acceptable amount of space is between the pilot bearing and inputshaft for this type of conversion. I know that I measured other pilot bearing variances on the subaru input shafts for 2.5l and the 3.0 l and they were no more than .1 mm in difference.

Any help would be great. I am ultimatly wondering if folks have used different pilot bearings to close that gap up and decrease the play?

Thanks
James

Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:50 pm

If I were you I'd get a stock VW pilot bearing and measure it to see how your subaru bearing compares. I don't think it's supposed to be a tight fit in the first place, but I might be wrong.

Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:06 pm

Hey Dude,

Have you tried posting at SubaruVanagon (dealing with Subaru engine conversions into Vanagons) or even more specifically, SVXVanagon (dealing with..... :roll: )?

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/subaruvanagon/

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/SVXVanagon/

You're much more likely to receive answers on those forums. You should also try http://www.subaru-svx.net/forum/

Good luck,

Chester

Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:54 am

Like Chester said, I'd even contact Rick at RJES and ask him what his experience has been. May as well get right to the source. Although this is a subaru conversion, the input shaft is still VW.

Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:39 am

There is a pilot bearing with the exact specs of the VW one but with a seal
at one end. That at least protects the grease to some extent. I use it
exclusively in TDI conversions and it is doing better than the stock one
so far.

INA HK1514RS

Serge

Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:10 pm

I've added some detailed replies to the original post on vwkd.co.uk. In summary, the pilot bearing (a 6002 model) can't possibly have an ID of 14.91mm, as that's way out of tolerance. I measures a lot yesterday, and the biggest variance I found was about 6 microns.
Also, the comments about variance in the VW shaft diameter do not match my experience. The shafts seem quite tightly toleranced around a 14.9mm nominal diameter, which is about what I'd expect.

I believe the gearbox is with AA Transaxle. Please get them to re-checl the dimensions. I suspect they must habe been measured with a set of calipers which were not zeroed properly, etc.

Also, there is more to this failure according to the guy who installed the conversion than the pilot bearing. Other bearings in the box have failed, possibly due to oil starvation or debris during a previous gearbox failure (caused by a damaged prop shaft - it's a Syncro).

Please see http://www.vwkd.co.uk/bb/viewtopic.php?p=11245#11245 for the full details.

I'll do what I can to help. You are unlikely to find anyone on the forums who knows more about the tolerances and design of RJES products as I do, as I designed and manufacture them myself!

Thanks,

Richard,
www.rjes.com

Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:24 pm

Hi Richard,
So What does one of your fine Bellhouses
cost delivered here to the US ( Utah )
And/or, will you ship here?
Thanks,
John C...
SLC, UT...

Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:27 pm

This exact thing just happened to me. The original pilot bearing is plastic and will melt with enough heat (so much for driving all the way from WI to CO in one mega-day). Anyone having transmission work done should replace this regardless of whether or not it needs replacing. Replace it with the metal one instead (the plastic one costs $4 and the metal one is $25). When my bearing failed, it lodged itself into the clutch and I could no longer shift. If you need more info, please call Lucas at Wild Westy in CO who did the work to replace it. Their number is 303-440-0243

Tue Jul 29, 2008 3:29 pm

wildenbeast wrote: The original pilot bearing is plastic and will melt with enough heat...

I'm not sure what you are refering to here, but the RJES bearing is not plastic and never has been. It is a sealed bearing and is specific to the RJES kit.

John C, Richard definately ships to the US. Contact him via the RJES.com website, he is very helpful. The bellhousing kit costs $930.00 for the N/A version and $1069.00 for the Turbo version without shipping.

I HIGHLY recommend the RJES bellhousing kit. It is top notch quality.