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Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9810
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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 Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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I love driving my fast car fast... but I would never try to camp in it.
I love camping in my Westy... but have no interest in driving it fast.
I understand some are bothered by the possibly underpowered nature of the WBX, but really - how much speed can one expect to get with the aerodynamics of a brick? |
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pdm777
Samba Member
Joined: August 06, 2012
Posts: 348
Location: Clovis, CA
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:59 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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You must be luddite flatlanders 
Ever take your Westy above 8,000 feet?
Carson Pass 8,573 ft
Tioga pass 9,943 ft
Ebbetts Pass 8,732 ft
my 1995 Toyota Previa AWD 2.4L factory Supercharged
was AWESOME with little power loss at altitude
158 hp @ 5,000 rpm
190 lb·ft @ 3,600 rpm
modern Toyota Sienna minivans are better:
TORQUE 245 ft-lbs. @ 4700 rpm
HORSEPOWER 266 hp @ 6200 rpm
Why can't we have 'modern' powerplants ????
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vegpedlr
Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2014
Posts: 774
Location: TBD
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 8:32 am Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| pdm777 wrote: |
You must be luddite flatlanders
Ever take your Westy above 8,000 feet? |
Yup. In the area mentioned, Monitor Pass, 8,314 ft. Other passes out in AZ and UT. Stock WBX.
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| Why can't we have 'modern' powerplants ???? |
These aren't 'modern' vehicles. And you can swap in more powerful if you're willing to spend the money. I'd love to have more power for men passes, but I can't justify spending more $ on an engine swap than I have in the van total to this point when my current WBX rebuild has lots of life left.
Porsche engines only belong in Porsche cars. Full stop. |
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pdm777
Samba Member
Joined: August 06, 2012
Posts: 348
Location: Clovis, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:53 am Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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Porsche engines only belong in Porsche cars. Full stop.
DOGMA ALERT!
FACT: JC says: Porsches are no more than hot rodded VWs.
A German flat six will will allow an old Westy to keep up with Prius and mommy vans.
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vegpedlr
Samba Member
Joined: June 07, 2014
Posts: 774
Location: TBD
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:18 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| pdm777 wrote: |
Porsche engines only belong in Porsche cars. Full stop.
DOGMA ALERT!
FACT: JC says: Porsches are no more than hot rodded VWs.
A German flat six will will allow an old Westy to keep up with Prius and mommy vans.
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That's awesome! Best trompe d'ceil I've seen in a while.
Let me clarify. Porsches are beautiful cars worthy of preservation and restoration, especially air cooled. For every Porsche engine, there must be a Porsche car somewhere that needs it. Not a VW. I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone will be restoring Legacies and Imprezas, so when their owners dispose of their disposable cars and get ready to dispose of more of their disposable income on something newer and fancier, makes sense to put that boxer engine to use.
OTOH, considering what Porsche did with air cooled flat sixes, what they still do with water cooled flat sixes, what Oettinger did, why we never got a more powerful option. |
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CampWesty
Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2012
Posts: 70
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 9:11 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| ahmadahere wrote: |
| I am working on a 1987 VW Westie, floor to topper, rebuild and I want to upgrade/update the engine. I am looking at GoWesty and FAS. I like FAS because they offer higher horsepower and turn-key kits. What are some other US companies that you have worked and what did you like about their product? |
Can't believe no one has mentioned Bostig yet: http://www.bostig.com/
Their setup is similar in power to the FAS gas kit pdm777 listed. Bostig is catered to DIY installs, but third-party installers can be found. I can attest that anyone with the motivation can complete their conversion. Before I did my Bostig install I had only changed my oil. I literally did not know what half the parts were called/looked like before I started. I can't imagine an engine being much easier to work on than the Zetec, not to mention parts availability and prices will be tough to beat.
_________________
Eric
1985 Wolfsburg Westy Weekender, Bostig RG5
Bostig Facebook Group
Vanagon Nation Facebook Group
Instrument Cluster Foil Repair Kits - Fix your faulty blue foil for good! |
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buildyourown
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2009
Posts: 1668
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 10:16 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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I saw the FAS kit the other day and am genuinely curious why its so expensive.
The Bostig kit is half the price and more power with better parts availability.
Not trying to start an argument, but whats the draw? |
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mellowslow
Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2009
Posts: 278
Location: Vacationland
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| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:16 am Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| buildyourown wrote: |
I saw the FAS kit the other day and am genuinely curious why its so expensive.
The Bostig kit is half the price and more power with better parts availability.
Not trying to start an argument, but whats the draw? |
I have a FAS gen V kit in my van. Maybe I can answer the question.
The FAS turnkey kit comes with a zero mileage engine and is ready for install out of the crate.
With the Bostig kit you have to find your own motor and more assembly is involved to install the kit. Naturally it would be cheaper, no engine.
I am not a production numbers expert but do you mean Ford Zetec has better engine parts availability than VW Golf IV?
VW did make quite a few of them and Jettas, NB, etc.
Big respect for Bostig. Those kits are tough and a lot of people like them and are very happy with the Ford engines. OP read what they say about transmissions.
I was looking at projects in the FAS yard last week, there were several built syncro diesels, AAZ and a 2.0 Pumpe Duse. Jon remarked at the power that these Diesel vans (including his) have and that, "if it squats when you lay on the accelerator, its going to be hard on the transmission." 
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'87 WBWE FAS Gen V |
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nemobuscaptain
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Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 3874
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CampWesty
Samba Member
Joined: September 05, 2012
Posts: 70
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:14 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| mellowslow wrote: |
| buildyourown wrote: |
I saw the FAS kit the other day and am genuinely curious why its so expensive.
The Bostig kit is half the price and more power with better parts availability.
Not trying to start an argument, but whats the draw? |
I have a FAS gen V kit in my van. Maybe I can answer the question.
The FAS turnkey kit comes with a zero mileage engine and is ready for install out of the crate.
With the Bostig kit you have to find your own motor and more assembly is involved to install the kit. Naturally it would be cheaper, no engine.
I am not a production numbers expert but do you mean Ford Zetec has better engine parts availability than VW Golf IV?
VW did make quite a few of them and Jettas, NB, etc.
Big respect for Bostig. Those kits are tough and a lot of people like them and are very happy with the Ford engines. OP read what they say about transmissions. |
That's what I was assuming the main difference was, but it's nice to get confirmation.
I'm not sure on exact production numbers either, but there's millions of Zetecs out there, which obviously makes parts availability much easier and cheaper. I picked up a 42,000 mile engine on Craigslist for $100 bucks. Did nothing internally to it except check the timing and it has ran like a champ.
| nemobuscaptain wrote: |
| buildyourown wrote: |
I saw the FAS kit the other day and am genuinely curious why its so expensive.
The Bostig kit is half the price and more power with better parts availability.
Not trying to start an argument, but whats the draw? |
It's not a Ford Focus engine, for starters.
I've never understood the draw of people wanting to put Focus engines in their busses.... or Pinto engines before that. That being said, I have never driven a bus with a Ford Focus engine in it, or even seen one, though I have driven a bus with a Pinto engine. |
Yeah, I mean, who would want to put a cheap, easy to work on, super reliable engine in their van? 
The Bostig Zetec was an easy sell for me once I discovered it. I drove a 2003 Ford Focus for 6+ years and had zero issues. Only needed basic maintenance... change fluids, brake pads, etc. My dad also drove a 2003 Ford Focus and put 300,000 miles on it, again, with only basic maintenance. The car was literally rusting out around him once he finally got rid of it.
Admittedly I discovered FAS late in the game, but they would be my second choice after Bostig. I've never understood the Subaru craze...I guess because it was one of the first conversion options and blind brand loyalty. I wouldn't touch a Subaru with a ten foot pole. Between Bostig, FAS, and the SAH 1.8T (if you're in California), all three are much better options. Bostig and FAS hit the sweet spot as far as a nice bump in power but not so much where you're going to be eating transaxles.
_________________
Eric
1985 Wolfsburg Westy Weekender, Bostig RG5
Bostig Facebook Group
Vanagon Nation Facebook Group
Instrument Cluster Foil Repair Kits - Fix your faulty blue foil for good! |
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jimf909 
Samba Member
Joined: April 03, 2014
Posts: 7473
Location: WA/ID
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| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:31 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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| nemobuscaptain wrote: |
I've never understood the draw of people wanting to put Focus engines in their busses.... or Pinto engines before that. That being said, I have never driven a bus with a Ford Focus engine in it, or even seen one, though I have driven a bus with a Pinto engine. |
A Focus engine in my Vanagon is an absolute delight to drive. Whether to work everyday or for hundreds of miles a day on vacation. I'm guessing it's similar to a FAS conversion.
As for the draw, I can tell you that after 19 years of Vanagon ownership, a Bostig conversion has transformed my Vanagon experience to one that's much more enjoyable in every regard. My guess is that a FAS conversion would offer a similar transformation.
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- Jim
| Abscate wrote: |
Do not get killed, do not kill others.
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Current: 1990 Westy Camper - Bostig RG4, 2wd, manual trans w/Peloquin, NAHT high-top, 280 ah LFP battery, 160 watts solar, Flash Silver, seam rust, bondo, etc., etc.
Past: 1985 Westy Camper - 1.9 wbx, 2wd, manual trans, Merian Brown, (sold after 17 years to Northwesty who converted it to a Syncro). |
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chachi
Samba Member
Joined: November 18, 2003
Posts: 858
Location: the weeds
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| Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2016 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: VW Waterboxer Engine Replacement Options |
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i found RJE's bedside manner a little lacking but maybe he just didn't like me (when i'm paying you $10k+ i feel like i'm pretty likeable). on the other hand chris at vanistan (we got the exhaust) is prompt to email and a super nice guy. if i had it to do over i would have either installed our RJE myself or gone w chris.
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'74 transporter panel
'91 vanagon carat NAHT |
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