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advise on an 1835 build please.
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chubby53
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PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2016 8:25 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

So I got my cam today. There was a big yellow flyer that said WARNING, this camshaft was designed to be used with special WEB-CAM high performance lifters and is not comparable with stock or reground parts.

So do I need to get WEB-CAM lifters for it now? I was just going to reuse some stock ones that looked in good shape.
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PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2016 8:34 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Found this: Cam Lifters compatible with WEB Camshafts But I used the CB-Performance ultra-light-weight lifters but they cost like $109, Scat racing lifters are only about $50 but a little heaver but the new stock AA Performance lifters are something like $30 but pretty heavy. I think light weight lifters make a noticeable difference though.
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PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2016 8:59 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

You can run them with SCAT or Web-Cam lifters. I would not use anything else.

chubby53 wrote:
So I got my cam today. There was a big yellow flyer that said WARNING, this camshaft was designed to be used with special WEB-CAM high performance lifters and is not comparable with stock or reground parts.

So do I need to get WEB-CAM lifters for it now? I was just going to reuse some stock ones that looked in good shape.

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chubby53
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PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2016 9:01 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Copy that. Thanks. More shipping charges here I come.
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chubby53
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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 7:46 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

holy lifters batman. i don't know what to get. is there anything to stay away from or anything specific to get? "lube a lobe" or "super 72" or "high rev lightwieght racing" don't know
http://www.scatvw.com/lifters-push-rods/
Or should i just get the web cam lifters direct from them? Part# 00-213? I don't mind paying whatever i need to to get the right parts.
Do i need extra wide heads to accomodate my lift?
Man who would of thunk there is so much to this... Shocked

Then i started thinking, should i have my heads and P&C to do a test fit before i seal the case? to make sure all clearances are good, ect?? Or can i bolt up an old head/pistion/cylinder just to check?(i have a head, piston/cylindar laying around my shop)
man i'm freaking out(not really, but it feels like it)
there was also this big long check list with my cam of all these other clearances to check that i know nothing about.
I guees i'll do some research and get more into questions on that if i can't find the anwesers. seems like a lot of shit for a cam.
somehow i think it's not as difficult as my brain is making it out to be. I just want to get the shortblock done, but seems like it never will be at this rate.
once again fellas, any help would be awesome. thank you
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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 8:12 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

I've used 3 Web cams with light-weight SCAT lifters, one set was SLR treated (this was around 2006), the others were more recent. Last one I broke in using dual springs. Knock on wood -- so far so good, I basically just follow John's advice on this.

Long-term, I think many lifters pit. I've torn apart a few 1600s with German or whatever else lifters, all had pitting but cams still worked.

I test-fit my engines a dozen times before sealing the shortblock. Also, I set up valve geometry and cut pushrods while doing test fit, not after shortblock is done.

The more times you assemble/take it apart, the more comfortable you should be with it. Just go extra slow and pay attention to everything. People will frown, but you can get a lot done just by feel, "if it spins, it'll run" lol. Many a engine have been thrown together that way and lived, so measure, take your time and don't worry.

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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 8:20 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

doesn't matter for this engine, get the cheapest SCAT lifters. The SCAT lifter pitting/flaking problem was from 15 years ago, and people still bring it up. It's irrelevant if you use new ones, only an issue if you are buying/using lifters from 15 years ago.
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Danwvw
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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 10:46 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

I just weighed some old lifters out of an old engine stock vw from a 74 beetle I think, they were pretty worn out no pitting though just very concave. They weigh 97 Grams which makes the Scat Super Duty seem like a wonderful choice if they are only 72 Grams. My CB-Ultra-Light's are advertized to be 22 grams lighter than stock which would put them at 75 grams. I wish I had tried the "Scat Super Duty" lifters in my Stock-ish 1679cc engine I just did the 20 minute cam run break-in on with the CB-1512 Stock lifters.
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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 12:13 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

what does the lightened lifter do for the engine? Does it rev faster or less wear?
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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 9:31 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Yeah I think they quiet the valve train some for sure they take less energy to operate especially if the cam has a steep ramp.
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 10:31 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

So I ordered the skat super duty 72 lifters, man ton .035 pushrods, and skat rocker arm geometry kit. Should be here at the end of next week. I should be able to put the short block together next weekend. What do I need to check for on cam install? Should I wait for final assembly of the block until I get cylinders and heads?
Good news is that I'm working a ton of overtime so I should be able to get my heads in two weeks. Hopefully have them here in 5 weeks. If I can swing it on my budget I'm going to try to order this week.
Still need solid rockers, elephant feet adjusters, and whatever else I'm forgetting.
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PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2016 6:19 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Always assemble the engine all the way to the heads once before doing the final case sealing of the short block. While not as necessary with a stock stroke crankshaft, things like uneven cylinder deck or pulled head studs can have you pulling everything back apart. Best to find it now.
With the cam, check the gear backlash, lifter to lifter boss clearance at full lift, and interference with the back or the oil pump. Sometimes you need to switch bolts, grind them, or grind the back of the pump. Set the crankshaft end play, it's easier now than with a fully assembled engine. Ponder how the distributor drive goes in so you're sure it goes in clocked correctly. I put it in before I set the case halves, but many do not.
Just my .02
SD
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PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2016 7:34 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Thanks. I already have the dizzy I stalled. I will look up how to check all clearances
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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 5:53 am    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Got my lifters. Crazy how thin the head looks compared to stock.
Here is a dumb question. I looked and searched and couldn't find an anwser.
For lifter installation. The big machined slots in the sides ... I'm guessing the need to run fron to back on the motor so oil gets in there good? Or are the ment to run side to side to help lubricant the lifter hole in the case?
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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 5:24 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

chubby53 wrote:
Got my lifters. Crazy how thin the head looks compared to stock.
Here is a dumb question. I looked and searched and couldn't find an anwser.
For lifter installation. The big machined slots in the sides ... I'm guessing the need to run fron to back on the motor so oil gets in there good? Or are the ment to run side to side to help lubricant the lifter hole in the case?


The lifters rotate while the engine is running, so just put assembly lube on them when you finish the short block. Just make sure you have cam to lifter clearance so it has plenty of room to slide back and forth without beating parts together. I think it's a .040" clearance minimum IIRC
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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Cool thanks
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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 9:48 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Okay. So I put in the cam in and bolted the case together. Everything got super tight. I know it's not the crank cause I bolted it together without the cam in and it turned nice and smooth. I tried checking backlash and the cam didn't walk out turning the engine backwards, however it didn't seem like there was any play at all. ( if I'm checking it right). No "clunk or clink".
I'm at a loss.
What do I do now? I don't know how to troubleshoot or fix this.
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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 9:54 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

leave the crank out, cam in and bolt it. I'll bet the cam thrust is tight.

DO NOT SAND ANYTHING UNTIL YOU REPORT BACK
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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 9:54 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

Sometimes it it helps to set the cam in it's thrust bearing using a rubber mallet to the end of the cam at the gear end. I had to sand down my cam thrust bearing (just a little) on one engine. Make sure you did not pench a main bearing it is something we all must double check. Never tighten case bolts if it starts to tighten up. Take it apart something is wrong.
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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2016 9:56 pm    Post subject: Re: advise on an 1835 build please. Reply with quote

How do you mean cam thrust is tight? In what way?
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