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stonecoldcars
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Joined: February 21, 2013
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Location: Oregon
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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 Posted: Sun May 29, 2016 8:13 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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So at this point To fill in on the videos. Like i said earlier I had to install a new fuel pump, Than the fuel pump relay worked 3 rimes and stopped working. so I jump the relay to make the pump work. Was than able to pressurize the system and found that I only had 22 psi of pressure.. So we adjusted the FPR to achieve the 28psi. attempted to start it with the pump relay jumped.. well that didn't work (1st Video) I had no computer signal to fire the injectors.. So we had spark and no fuel. So after some fiddling around I found a poor connection at my trigger points connector. I applied pin tension at the connector and BOOM I now had a fuel pump relay working. So we learned that the trigger points have a direct connection to making the pump relay work.. So as shown in the in the 2nd video it now tries to run but just will not accelerate at all nor idle.. and was running SUPER RICH!! Well after one of my last posts with pics of my MPS , was talking to Tram about it, he said someone had diffently been messing with the adjustment screw possibly trying to compensate low fuel pressure or dying pump... So I decided to mess around with it and turned to screw in clockwise a turn at a time and also advance the dist a little.. Now for the 3rd video..
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22727
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Sun May 29, 2016 8:59 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Good work! You are gaining on it! I am over in Ohio with my dad until Thurs. then I will be back in Oregon if you want to hook it up to my sniffer and dial it in sometime.
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 7:42 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Tram, I'm pretty sure I screwed up, I was just hoping that I hadn't.. Fuel injection newbie mistake lesson.. UGH!! So I've been trying to get it to run better, timing, valve adjust, blah blah blah. It was running, but just wasn't running right. So... while running I start pulling off plug wires one at a time off the distributor cap. Well cyl's 1 and 4 are dead no response.. I pull out the spark plugs they are brand new and zero fuel smell.. Pull out cyl's 2 and 3 they are super soot fouled, but are burning.. So I think okay I'll back track and double check starting with my trigger points, so using my DVOM they check out fine with continuity removed in my hand as well as in the distributor and manually turning the rotor they break fine. I've done pin tension on every connector.. So I than went back to my injectors with my 9v battery and wire leads, both injectors click fine. So that leaves me thinking of only two things, wiring and/or computer. And I'm leaning towards computer and here is why,
This would be were I F'd up as a newbie! So early on before we got it running, when I was having fuel pump relay problems and trying to figure out why it wasn't switching. I had tested with my test light on the terminals. I had +12v bat, and 12v switch from main relay, But I had a weak ground(tested by reversing my test lead to a 12v source) .. So my mind said that the ground was crapping and I introduced a good outside ground to that pin... Well the relay worked and the fuel pump kicked on. I thought I had won and went back to the engine and cleaned all the grounds and the relay worked after that..But.... than the next day while on break at work I was reading in the Bentley manual it clearing stated "Do not ground the fuel pump relay or computer damage may occur" !! So yeah, that's were I'm sitting on this.. Any ideas or additional tests I can do? Or pretty much nail in the coffin on my part..?
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22727
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 8:34 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| stonecoldcars wrote: |
Tram, I'm pretty sure I screwed up, I was just hoping that I hadn't.. Fuel injection newbie mistake lesson.. UGH!! So I've been trying to get it to run better, timing, valve adjust, blah blah blah. It was running, but just wasn't running right. So... while running I start pulling off plug wires one at a time off the distributor cap. Well cyl's 1 and 4 are dead no response.. I pull out the spark plugs they are brand new and zero fuel smell.. Pull out cyl's 2 and 3 they are super soot fouled, but are burning.. So I think okay I'll back track and double check starting with my trigger points, so using my DVOM they check out fine with continuity removed in my hand as well as in the distributor and manually turning the rotor they break fine. I've done pin tension on every connector.. So I than went back to my injectors with my 9v battery and wire leads, both injectors click fine. So that leaves me thinking of only two things, wiring and/or computer. And I'm leaning towards computer and here is why,
This would be were I F'd up as a newbie! So early on before we got it running, when I was having fuel pump relay problems and trying to figure out why it wasn't switching. I had tested with my test light on the terminals. I had +12v bat, and 12v switch from main relay, But I had a weak ground(tested by reversing my test lead to a 12v source) .. So my mind said that the ground was crapping and I introduced a good outside ground to that pin... Well the relay worked and the fuel pump kicked on. I thought I had won and went back to the engine and cleaned all the grounds and the relay worked after that..But.... than the next day while on break at work I was reading in the Bentley manual it clearing stated "Do not ground the fuel pump relay or computer damage may occur" !! So yeah, that's were I'm sitting on this.. Any ideas or additional tests I can do? Or pretty much nail in the coffin on my part..? |
The car runs and the FP relay works correctly, yes?
The damage they are talking about in the ECU is for the pump grounding circuit.
I think you have a wiring issue. Check your FI grounds- they ground in pairs.
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| Bryan67 wrote: |
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 9:03 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Yes, car starts and runs. and fuel pump relay works every time now. Aside from the two dead cyl's, the MPS needs fine tuning, But pointless until I have all four cyl's working
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Well it's still a no go. I've cleaned every ground from the battery on. I've back probed the wiring connectors from the trigger points to the injectors and injectors to the paired grounds at each bank. All good..But Still no injector pulse on 1 and 4. I even used my chassis ears to confirm no pulse. But yet I can but my 9v and wire leads on the injectors and they pulse and spray the rail pressure out.. So the only thing I don't know how to do is test the signal from the computer.. If I had another one I would just try it.. Mike Fisher has a "B" computer but I'm not sure if it's compatible to my "A"
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rustyfastback
Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2002
Posts: 839
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 7:28 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| The "B" computer will work fine. I had a "B" computer in my early '68 squareback. |
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Mon May 30, 2016 10:23 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Frustrated with the running problems I moved on to other things. installed all new brake soft hoses, new rear wheel cyl's , bleed the brakes, lowered the front suspension two clicks, installed the missing side molding and rocker moldings, removed the damaged front bumper for a nice used replacement. and final icing on the cake the new wheels and tires.. looks dang nice.. Now if only it would run as ggod as it's new look... Ugh 
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 10:28 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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I have my Bentley manual back today that I didn't have over the weekend. Found the wiring schematic on the whole system with wire pin# id. So I will be disconnecting the computer and running continuity tests on each of the wires to check for any possible breaks between the computer and component. I didn't realize the wires were also numbered though alot of my number are barely recognizable anymore. LOL.. I WILL WIN THIS BATTLE.. But doesn't look like I'll be making my goal it to Woodurn this weekend.
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bugnut68
Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2003
Posts: 4180
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 7:44 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| Those wheels are an awesome choice. I love 2.0 liter 914 alloys. |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22727
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue May 31, 2016 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| stonecoldcars wrote: |
| I have my Bentley manual back today that I didn't have over the weekend. Found the wiring schematic on the whole system with wire pin# id. So I will be disconnecting the computer and running continuity tests on each of the wires to check for any possible breaks between the computer and component. I didn't realize the wires were also numbered though alot of my number are barely recognizable anymore. LOL.. I WILL WIN THIS BATTLE.. But doesn't look like I'll be making my goal it to Woodurn this weekend. |
The Father's Day show at Springfield German is within towing distance... 
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 3:02 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Well , I guess I'm down to pulling out the injectors and swapping them. I've traced continuity on every wire from the computer main plug to each component, grounds and tested resistance on all the injectors. They all matched @ 2.7-2.9 which I believe is a little higher than spec 2.4 or less??? but regardless they are all the same. I also did resistance on the trigger points, both sides where the same @0.05 and Bentley says zero , so they are a little high but the same.
So that leaves me to moving the injectors and seeing if the problem stays or moves with them. if the problem stays, I have no idea were to go next. Ugh... From what I've read the computer only controls speed of pulse and duration. So if its not wiring, not grounds, not trigger points, and not the injectors..?? I did read a blip about the MPS might have some say in injector pulse but it was a little unclear to me and I got the impression it would effect all of them and not by bank??.. Anyways, I'll keep plugging away at it.. The good news about all this is look at the experience I'm getting..LOL
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Clatter
Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003
Posts: 7544
Location: Santa Cruz
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| Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 10:40 pm Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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Can't help you with any of this, other than to offer encouragement and props..
Nice to see your clean, respectful treatment to this little beauty here.
A nice contrast to some of the fuckery that takes place in some of these build threads!
My experience with L-Jet is that you will never know all of the details or gremlins hiding - you just have to chase enough of them away that the thing runs right.
There is a chance that what is wrong with your car might have never been wrong with any car before or since; impossible to predict what a PO will do.
So, take a step back, and look at it from afar.
It would very well be one of those issues, that you never could have imagined in 100 years.. 
Isn't that a '57 Fairlane I spy...?
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stonecoldcars
Samba Member
Joined: February 21, 2013
Posts: 265
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:11 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| Clatter wrote: |
Can't help you with any of this, other than to offer encouragement and props..
Nice to see your clean, respectful treatment to this little beauty here.
A nice contrast to some of the fuckery that takes place in some of these build threads!
My experience with L-Jet is that you will never know all of the details or gremlins hiding - you just have to chase enough of them away that the thing runs right.
There is a chance that what is wrong with your car might have never been wrong with any car before or since; impossible to predict what a PO will do.
So, take a step back, and look at it from afar.
It would very well be one of those issues, that you never could have imagined in 100 years..
Isn't that a '57 Fairlane I spy...? |
Thanks, I'll figure it out. Just not finding the obvious. Guess that would be to easy. LOL And yes you are correct that is a 57 ford Fairlane 500 sedan
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22727
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:11 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| Clatter wrote: |
Can't help you with any of this, other than to offer encouragement and props..
Nice to see your clean, respectful treatment to this little beauty here.
A nice contrast to some of the fuckery that takes place in some of these build threads!
My experience with L-Jet is that you will never know all of the details or gremlins hiding - you just have to chase enough of them away that the thing runs right.
There is a chance that what is wrong with your car might have never been wrong with any car before or since; impossible to predict what a PO will do.
So, take a step back, and look at it from afar.
It would very well be one of those issues, that you never could have imagined in 100 years..
Isn't that a '57 Fairlane I spy...? |
Good thing the OP's car is D-jet then, eh?
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| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
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Clatter
Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003
Posts: 7544
Location: Santa Cruz
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:51 am Post subject: Re: My new 68 Fastback "Desert Rat" |
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| Tram wrote: |
| Clatter wrote: |
Can't help you with any of this, other than to offer encouragement and props..
Nice to see your clean, respectful treatment to this little beauty here.
A nice contrast to some of the fuckery that takes place in some of these build threads!
My experience with L-Jet is that you will never know all of the details or gremlins hiding - you just have to chase enough of them away that the thing runs right.
There is a chance that what is wrong with your car might have never been wrong with any car before or since; impossible to predict what a PO will do.
So, take a step back, and look at it from afar.
It would very well be one of those issues, that you never could have imagined in 100 years..
Isn't that a '57 Fairlane I spy...? |
Good thing the OP's car is D-jet then, eh? |
Oh, Tram, a PO is capable of some fuckery with D-Jet also..
Ever see this thread? 
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=514048
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