Diving In. 1st Engine Rebuild

[mark tucker]

pull number 21 and clean!!!!! then tap&add pipe plug(I like brass/bronze plugs, they expand the same and dont stick&effup the threads like aluminum or steel. rimco should of done this, but with thier quality of work........better check it all over real well....also good idea to slot the lifter bores. I go about 1/4"outward and3/8" inward(toward the cam is inward) with about a .080 -.100wide by about .040-.060 deep at the oil gallly holes.this gives the rockers full time oiling, not spirt&squirt.and ghelps cool heads/valves/springs and rocker assy. eazy to do.dremol or diegrinder with ballend bit.

[Abouna]

Made some decent progress this week. Slow, but steady.

Here's my setup for cleaning the oil galleries.

First I blasted out all the holes with compressed air to get the loose stuff out of the way. Then I set up a bucket with a squeeze bottle of mineral spirits, and some bore brushes. I went through the whole case with the brushes, multiple times. The oil galleries were all very clean (guess my engine was pretty clean to begin with) but several of the case bolt holes around the edge had crud in them. I spent a lot of time scraping these clean. I know it's not a huge deal if these are a little grungy, but I didn't want to risk any interior contamination so I cleaned them.

I then blasted out the galleries and the whole case with more compressed air to get the solvent out. Then I moved onto a sink with hot water and dish soap. Cleaned everything again with bore brushes, then thoroughly dried the case with compressed air and hair drier.

After I thought I was done, I found that the bottom of the sump area below the lifters still had a thin film of grime. I could wipe it off with my finger with a lot of pressure. So back to the sink and hot soapy water. This time with a stiff bottle brush (for the nooks and crannies) and a scotch brite pad. I scrubbed the inside of the case several times until I could wipe my finger across the metal with no residue visible. This took me about 2 hours all told. I have no idea how clean this needs to be, but I thought I'd get it as clean as I could. I'm already paranoid about this build, so what change now? Haha!

I read that my new chromoly head studs would be too long. So I mocked up the case with my new cylinders and heads to check their length.

Here's my questions: I'm planning on cutting them off so there's about 1/4" of stud left past the nut. I figure this will allow enough clearance for rocker arms and intake manifolds, plus allow some thread in case I need cylinder shims. Sound good?

Does anyone know what the stamped numbers in my cyl heads refer to? Looks like one was ground down and restamped. Any ideas?

[mikedjames]

I managed to rebuild an engine out of my old engine and a £51 rusty oily lump I bought off eBay on the driveway behind my bus over a few days last year.

Starting off with no engine building experience but I watched a lot of Youtube videos and read the Samba.

Mixed in some new parts but basically rebuilt the same 1641 that I had before.

I got lucky because the rusty lump had a nice OG crank never machined and a flywheel.
And the case was a never linebored AS21 case once I got the water and oily gunk out.
And a friend with a big parts washer let me thoroughly wash out the block once I had cleaned it up properly. That engine probably died years ago with a burnt out valve and was left to rot until some guy had a clear out.


I kept the challenge level low by not upgrading, and I did have enough parts from two engines to cover up for my stupid mistakes - like turning the engine the wrong way and chewing up the brass distributor drive gear on the crank.

So I probably put it together and took it apart about three times before it was right.

So far I have done about 5000 miles on the rebuild and it seems to be running much better now than when I first built it.
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Ancient vehicles and vessels

1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.

1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy

[Abouna]

In diassembling my mockup I started thinking about the thermostat rod. My engine was missing the rod, thermostat, and thermostat mounting bracket. I couldn't find any clear pics of where the rod is supposed to fit between the cylinders and/or head. I've circled about the only place it can go in this engine. Cylinders are 90.5 Mahle. What are my options here?

[Brian]

I think it goes through the head, not there

Edit:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=106003
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[Abouna]

Do you have a better picture of that? Where it actually goes through perhaps?

[PatsGhia]

[Abouna]

Ok, Thanks. So I guess the factory missed that area then?

[Abouna]

Make some progress this week. Got the bearings, cam gear, dist gear, slinger and such mounted to the crank. And last night I mounted the rods to the crank. I'm using Lucas assembly lube. It's finally starting to come together. I'm excited!

[Abouna]

Made some progress this week. Got the bearings, cam gear, dist gear, slinger and such mounted to the crank. And last night I mounted the rods to the crank. I'm using Lucas assembly lube. It's finally starting to come together. I'm excited!

[Abouna]

I went to install my #2 bearing halves and discovered some small scratches and a couple dings. What should I do? I can feel the edge with my fingernail.

[PatsGhia]

Don't know why more people aren't responding on this thread but...I'm no expert but on the bearing deal, I would just take some 600 grit sandpaper, or if you have a steady hand, a sharp knife and just knock down the edges of the cuts in the bearing and run them. It doesn't look like a problem to me.

On the head deal, most people don't run a thermostat anymore, so the manufacturers don't bother to clean up that passage. I'd call CB and see what they recommend to clear it out - they have 2nd to none customer service IME.

[Abouna]

Thanks PatsGhia. I went ahead and hit the bearing id lightly with some scotch brite and a very fine stone to knock back the little burr on the ding. It rotates perfectly on the journal now. I discovered that these bearings are lined with babbit. I have a little experience with babbit from restoring old woodworking machines. Those bearings actually get poured in place around the shaft, split open, then hand scraped to fit. So I figure a couple tiny recesses in this one bearing isn't going to cause any trouble, if anything it gives me a tiny bit more room for oil, right? No doubt I'll get some response to this opinion! I did find a couple posts here where a guy had the same situation and the consensus was its no big deal.

Now I've got to figure out why my end play, when bench tested with maybe 40 pounds of torque on the gland nut, is .054". Bug Me Video says to do it this way, but I've read here that to really get an accurate end play figure the flywheel needs to be fully torqued, then measured. The three thickest shims available only add up to .045", and I've read wildly differing opinions on whether or not you can use more than three.

I had thought when I started this that there would be a very clear "best way" of putting an engine together, especially since VW made 20 million of them and all the issues should be worked out by now. But I'm learning that it's not the case at all. But thanks to this forum, support from CB Performance, John at Aircooled, and some local brains, I'm getting through this and learning more about this engine than I ever imagined. That's really the fun part for me. The knowledge! My next build will seem like a walk in the park by comparison!

[Abouna]

Made some real progress yesterday afternoon. Got everything in the left half of the case, including educating myself on timing and how to get the distributor drive gear oriented correctly. Also figured out how my new Magnaspark 2 distributor works.

So what happens if I accidentally put the wrong spark plug wire on the dizzy cap and the firing order is off? I'm not worried about getting it wrong, just curious about what happens if its off?

[Abouna]

Got the short block together today! No real issues that we didn't find answers to here and on the Bug Me video and Wilson book. Also got the Type 3 block off plate installed, and the new full-flow oil pump from CB Performance.

Next up we'll mock up a cylinder and check deck height. This is happening faster than I anticipated.

[wcfvw69]

Nice work.. What did you figure out in regards to why you had such a big end play gap?

I've only built three VW engines using the same video's and books. I LLOOVVEED the experience. I took my time and double and triple checked everything before assembling. Taking my time (which isn't not my strong suit) rewarded me with three beautifully running engines.

When they fire for the first time and you don't see oil pouring out of anywhere nor hear any loud knocking, the feeling is amazing.
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[Abouna]

Thanks. Believe me, I'm looking forward to that first fire like nothing else! It will either be magical or devastating.

Yesterday I found a pouch of end play shims that I forgot I bought from CB. They add up to a bit more than the end play I need, so I figure I can get real close with those and the old shims. The crank and FW are brand new from CB, so I'm hoping for the best. I'll test again after the engine is off the stand.

[Abouna]

Next step was to check my deck height. Then I realized I ordered a gasket set for a 1600, so the cylinder gaskets are too small for my 90.5's. So while I wait for gaskets I thought I'd measure my P+C's.

These are brand new 90.5 Mahle's. First up, ring gap. I'm following Bentley here. This is the top compression ring. That's a 20 thou feeler gauge, which is .002" past the upper limit (Bentley). The wear limit is .035", but it seems odd to me that these would be this far over the limit right out of the box. Is Bentley just outdated here? Or perhaps the spec here is fine for the Mahle Cylinder. The P+C's didn't come with any paperwork so I have nothing but Bentley and Wilson to go on.

Then I measured side clearance. The top two compression rings were within spec, but the oil ring has .004" gap. Bentley says .001 -.002, with a wear limit of .004. Anybody have experience here? Regardless, I'll be calling CB Performance tomorrow to see what I should do.

[saw2]

As far as cylinder gaskets if you are talking about cylinder base to case gaskets most use a sealent and no paper gaskets. RTV, Right Stuff etc. Just a small bead or amount sealent is all that is needed.

Do a search here, there are a lot oh photos of using a sealent for cylinder to case sealing.

[modok]

The bearing dents are not a problem, I would have left them alone, but it's fine to cut the high spots off too. The important thing is the clearance is right. Did you check the clearances?

Top ring gap of .020 is ok, .014-.024 would be acceptable imo
The side clearance is ok, because it is a three piece ring

Nobody uses the cylinder gaskets; throw those away.

So, all good so far, but if you want things to worry about
Did you see if the flywheel fits and check runout before putting it in the engine?
Did you polish the thrust surface of the cam?