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Pure Gas and E10 Regulations
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Ghia Nut
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:38 am    Post subject: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

Hello all. I use the Pure Gas ap to find filling stations that sell pure gas without the ethanol.

I found a station that was listed as having pure gas, considering his gas prices the ought to have been pure gas. Any who, just to make sure I was getting what I thought I was paying for (an additional .25 per gallon) I finally found the owner of the station at the store. He informed me that they havent had ethanol free in some time but there was a station down the street that did carry it.

Im happy he was honest with me and was able to point me in the right direction for my Ghia's fuel needs. Typically in Birmingham Alabama there is a GIGANTOR dead ring for pure fuel stations. I leave close smack dab to the center and the nearest station is 17 miles away which sucks.

Its to my understanding that most stations around lakes carry pure gas due to marine engines needing it etc. Sadly no huge lake in middle of birmingham.

The owner did tell me that there is rumored to be a regulation passed that mandates that ALL filling stations must use e10 in 2015, and since it is gubment regulated, there is nothing that filling stations can do about it. Not trying to spread rumors, but perhaps you guys could inquire/poke around the bushes at your local pure gas supplier and see whats up.
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vwracerdave
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It varies by state. Here in Oklahoma half the station carries pure gas. Some stations have dual pumps and sell both. All stations are required to label exactly what you are getting. If you are not getting what you pay for contact the state corporation commission, and the station could be heavily fined or closed for cheating the public.
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Helfen
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just picked this up U47. It's something we in the automotive industry have known for a long time through testing, but now a government study backs up manufacturers claims all along. Here it is.


Well, this is going to be a heartbreaker for the hysterical global warming crowd. According to a new study, emissions from burning corn are worse for the environment and produce more CO2 or 'global warming' gases than the burning of traditional gasoline.

Biofuels made from the leftovers of harvested corn plants are worse than gasoline for global warming in the short term, a study shows, challenging the Obama administration's conclusions that they are a much cleaner oil alternative and will help combat climate change.

A $500,000 study paid for by the federal government and released Sunday in the peer-reviewed journal Nature Climate Change concludes that biofuels made with corn residue release 7 percent more greenhouse gases in the early years compared with conventional gasoline.
The federal government has already dumped billions of dollars into facilities and programs producing biofuels in the name of preventing climate change but as usual, is having the opposite effect than originally intended.

Just last week, biofuel industry producers told the New York Times 2016 was the year they were looking most forward to bring cleaner energy to the United States. Oops.

“The whole purpose of the Renewable Fuel Standard was to encourage investment to create brand-new technologies that would help the United States become more energy-independent and use cleaner and more efficient fuels. We feel like we are just on the verge of doing that and now the E.P.A. is talking about changing the rules," Executive Vice President of the heavily subsidized biofuel company Abengoa Christopher Standlee said to the paper.

Al Gore, call your office.
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DougB
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 7:46 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

Sorry to resurrect an old thread...I heard on the news today that the EPA is considering a proposal (sounds like they're backed into a corner because of existing laws that mandate increasing the percentage of Ethanol in gas over time) to increase the Ethanol percentage.

https://www.epa.gov/renewable-fuel-standard-progra...mass-based

I know this is a topic of particular importance for VW drivers as we have to replace our fuel hoses more often because of even the current formulation. Not sure what some of the other engine effects might be...I submitted a comment via the EPA website through this email address:

[email protected]

...and also sent messages to each of the Senators from my state through their senatorial websites. You can find your's here (if interested):

http://www.senate.gov/senators/contact/

In case you're interested, here's what I wrote (feel free to copy if you'd like):

Quote:
"Hello Senator,

On the way to work today I heard a news article about the proposed increase to the Ethanol percentage in blended fuels. To the extent that you might be involved in the discussion, please reconsider this proposal, or at least mandate that gas stations also provide the current formulation as an additional option. As it is the 10% Ethanol in our current fuels hastens the deterioration of fuel hoses in our vehicles, and has the potential to adversely affect engine systems, operation or potentially damage older vehicles in which the engines were designed for completely non-Ethanol engines. I drive an old VW daily and already have to replace my rubber fuel hoses every 4 years ($50 a pop and about 6 hours of my time) just because of the effects of Ethanol on the hose compound.

Also, the EPA proposal means that the average driver will get less value from what they're purchasing, given the difference in energy output between gasoline and ethanol.

As a taxpayer I also find it difficult to swallow how much the Ethanol subsidy costs us indirectly, as well as the loss of farming fields for the production of dinner table-bound products. When there are clearer paths to non-combustable renewable energy sources it's difficult to understand the continuing emphasis and taxpayer support for Ethanol.

I'm just a normal citizen here who happens to be personally and adversely affected by the Ethanol in fuels...if there's a value to Ethanol beyond just offsetting 10% of gasoline usage (which could likely be made up in ways that provide longer term return, like better incentivization for electric vehicles or home efficiency programs) it's definitely not clear to the average person. The majority of my friends and family just see it as a handout to the powerful farm lobby at our expense."


I'm not arguing the left-ish or right-ish nature of this...but it's always seemed like Ethanol is not the best way to decrease the demand for gasoline in society. And as a VW driver I obviously want to keep driving my car for as long as possible.

Just thought I'd let you all know...

- Doug
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Helfen
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

Thanks for the links Doug. Writing your representatives is a very important step. Adding anything above 10% ethanol is not just a old car issue. My 2012 Nissan specifically says to not use anything above 10% or fuel system damage will occur.
This is not a left or right issue as said by Doug. The very different types of outcomes effects us all such as higher fuel prices, higher taxes, lower fuel economy, damaged fuel systems and engines and of all things higher pollution.
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KTPhil Premium Member
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 10:06 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

The real benefit of biofuels is not price or environmental benefit (both of which may actually be negative, as posted). It is insurance against another oil embargo. If the Mideast taps are cut off, we can get by domestically. It should always be a Plan B source, not Plan A, or we lose this insurance and national security benefit.
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vdubyah73
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

There is plenty of oil in North America. Why do you think there is a global price war? OPEC wants to bankrupt as many oil drilling companies it can by refusing to decrease output, in fact some nations are increasing production. I hope the country wakes up and determines that we as a nation are willing to pay a higher price at the pump and use our own resources. Don't let these nations that have a disdain for our way of life keep their fingers in our business anymore. There is no peak oil in the foreseeable future. There is still easily extracted oil being discovered, and fracking just needs to be developed further to make it safer. For instance most of the water being injected back into the ground is not tracking fluid it is fossil water that comes up with the oil. They ought to stop trucking it to injection wells and instead inject it back into the ground where the oil is being pumped out. Some oil ranches in Texas have numerous wells on the property. Maybe all the fossil water should be injected on the ranch it came from. Thet would probably help keep production levels higher and help avoid having to stimulate wells with more fracking as production levels decline.
What do I know? I was only a security puke for drill rigs and tracking crews, but men talk, ya know.

Bill
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vwracerdave
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

You need to understand what is going on and vote accordingly. If you are fed up with this crap and you don't vote then you don't get to bitch and complain when we can no longer drive our 1/2 century old cars on the roads.
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Helfen
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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2016 4:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

vwracerdave wrote:
You need to understand what is going on and vote accordingly. If you are fed up with this crap and you don't vote then you don't get to bitch and complain when we can no longer drive our 1/2 century old cars on the roads.


Just one thing here. EPA is the one mandating this stuff. Unfortunately EPA and IRS are not accountable to the Executive, Legislative, or Judicial branches of government, and this is a real problem for Americans because they do what they please and both branches as you all well know have been lately subverted politically to a political agenda.
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 11:05 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

Helfen wrote:
vwracerdave wrote:
You need to understand what is going on and vote accordingly. If you are fed up with this crap and you don't vote then you don't get to bitch and complain when we can no longer drive our 1/2 century old cars on the roads.


Just one thing here. EPA is the one mandating this stuff. Unfortunately EPA and IRS are not accountable to the Executive, Legislative, or Judicial branches of government, and this is a real problem for Americans because they do what they please and both branches as you all well know have been lately subverted politically to a political agenda.


To whom is the EPA accountable?
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Gary
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 11:46 am    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

Helfen wrote:
vwracerdave wrote:
You need to understand what is going on and vote accordingly. If you are fed up with this crap and you don't vote then you don't get to bitch and complain when we can no longer drive our 1/2 century old cars on the roads.


Just one thing here. EPA is the one mandating this stuff. Unfortunately EPA and IRS are not accountable to the Executive, Legislative, or Judicial branches of government, and this is a real problem for Americans because they do what they please and both branches as you all well know have been lately subverted politically to a political agenda.


Can you cite proof of your statement? I don't want to make this thread political; however, your statement deserves to be called out.

From 2014: Sometimes the IRS loses in court

From 2015: Supreme Court overturns landmark EPA air pollution rule

Both are agencies which operate under the authority of the legislature and also the current elected administration; however, each are sometimes spanked in court due to overreach or other reasons.

I don't know about you, but I think clean air, clean water, clean land are good to have.
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modok
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 2:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Pure Gas and E10 Regulations Reply with quote

It sure would make more sense just to do it by price.
Pure gas IS needed for classic cars and equipment that is used seasonally, and boats. They should just mark it up so it's slightly more expensive. Then average Joe will use the e15 like they want.

I'll use the e15 because it makes more power. I like more power!
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