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Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split.
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freddie89
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:27 am    Post subject: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. Reply with quote

Hi all, I have tried to search for a simple answer to this question but cant find one! Laughing

Basically am looking to fit a 60's short axle box into my 1951 crotch cooler, What do I need to do?

Thanks

Freddie
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Mr. Okrasa Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:41 am    Post subject: Re: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. Reply with quote

freddie89 wrote:
Hi all, I have tried to search for a simple answer to this question but cant find one! Laughing
Basically am looking to fit a 60's short axle box into my 1951 crotch cooler, What do I need to do?
Thanks
Freddie

Break out the welding torch! I've contemplated the same thing as I want to install a Berg 5 speed behinde a Denzel engine in my 1950 VW Beetle WITHOUT cutting/welding the original chassis structure but cant figure it out. If you want to install a tunnel type full synchro trans and still use a rubber factory mount, you have to modifly the nose cone from a type 2 bus. I have such a mount that allows you to do that WITHOUT any cutting nor welding of your mount nor chassis. I recieved this modified nose cone when I purchase one of my Split Window 356 Coupes. I asked the owner, "what a funny nose cone". He said that it was made to adapt a full type 1 tunnel/synchro transmission into your split beetle/356 chassis without no modifications. Now, if only someone can re-cast it and make them available to the general public. Cheers. Mr. Okrasa Cool
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Bruce
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Fitting 60's gearbox to 51 split. Reply with quote

Mr. Okrasa wrote:
If you want to install a tunnel type full synchro trans and still use a rubber factory mount, you have to modifly the nose cone from a type 2 bus. I have such a mount that allows you to do that WITHOUT any cutting nor welding of your mount nor chassis.

Pictures or it didn't happen!
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Jacks
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Barney guy got it figured out Laughing :
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1242083
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splitjunkie
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have seen that one before. It pushes the transmission back by 1/4" from what he says. Probably not too big of a deal.

To me it just doesn't look too strong. I hope it is and will hold up because it could prevent a lot of spits from being cut to put a later trans in. Seems to me that it it was welded together it would be a lot stronger.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't speak to the strength but I know he drove a Bus from Canada to the VW Classic and back with that set up and I didn't hear of any troubles.
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beetleseb
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bears motorsport here in the UK are planning to make such a nosecone

I'm trying it in both my 50 bug and my 56 bus for them. It should sit the box in the stock location and bolt up like a factory conversion

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


They are very busy and its taking a long time as its a spare time project. But it will happen one day!!

Seb
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splitjunkie
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's cool. Looks much like Concept1 was planning but didn't have the time.

keep us updated.
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gazlaw75
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a 1956 era type 2 nose cone on a 1959 full syncro box in my 1950, all holding up fine. no cutting, no welding, no hassle.
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splitjunkie
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The '59 tranny is not full synchromesh. First is not syncromesh on the split case transmissions.

Your solution for using a split case bus nose cone is the best way to put a split case syncro in a split but what this thread is about is putting a '61 and later full syncromesh tunnel, non split case tranny in a split.
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Jacks
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone tried this one?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1318980
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eurodub
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm... that does look clever enough!
i don't know if the urethane piece is glued good enough on the metal piece, but this system seems a nice setup. i don't know if the trans hits the upper section while shifting gears though, or if the trans nosecone is strong enough not to break.

i have a tunnel trans in my split and it's a pia. the front mount is bolted right to the chassis and the engine moves too much when i shift into gears. as i don't have at least a decent splitcase trans to mount a bus nosecone, i really need to find a good tested solution.
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splitjunkie
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jacks wrote:
Anyone tried this one?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1318980


That doesn't look like a very good design. There is hardly anything holding the doughnut in and it does not fill the entire hole. I am not sure what that retainer is supposed to do.

If the urethane mount was a full circle like the orginial with a hole in the center of the mount for the shift support and if it had a retaining plate that actually held the doughnut in, it might be pretty good.

I bet it caused the engine to be placed farther back in the vehicle like the other mount earlier in the thread.
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bally
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jacks wrote:
Anyone tried this one?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1318980


Has anyone tried this kit? Any feedback?

I'm planning on putting a March 63 tunnel trans in my 51. If I'm to stick a bus nose cone on it, which year bus nose cone do I need?

I'd love to have the proposed Bears nose cone - that sounds like the best solution, but I'm not sure how much longer it will be in development.

Cheers,

Dave
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Trevor P
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go with the Concept 1 mount.
It doesn't move anything back if the front rubber mount is prepped right. I cut 1/4" off the front rubber mount and everything fits in stock position just like it should. I'm running a 2180 and a later trans in my BD and it has held up just fine. We have run these mounts in buses driving from Canada to Cali 2 times (and many more kms since) with no issues.
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bally
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trevor P wrote:
Go with the Concept 1 mount.
It doesn't move anything back if the front rubber mount is prepped right. I cut 1/4" off the front rubber mount and everything fits in stock position just like it should. I'm running a 2180 and a later trans in my BD and it has held up just fine. We have run these mounts in buses driving from Canada to Cali 2 times (and many more kms since) with no issues.


Thanks for your input Trevor.

The ad the link further up the thread referred to had expired so I assumed these were no longer available. Not only are they still available, they are on sale!
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1382539

There is no mention of trimming the front rubber mount to get it all to fit as VW intended. Are they missing a trick here?


I do like the idea of this mount and using the original rubber bushing.

Cheers,

Dave
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Trevor P
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trimming the mount is a trick we found out doing the last couple installs. Make sure to lube the mount up really good so it slips in as the WW rubber is a tight fit. Very Happy
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bally
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Trevor - that sounds like good advice Smile

What's the top tip for trimming the rubber donut so it doesn't look like a hack job?

Maybe the advert should be updated with this top tip - I know it puts people off as is. It might also be worth producing narrower donuts specifically for these mounts although that may not be financially viable.

Cheers,

Dave
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Trevor P
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's about a 2 minute job with a bandsaw or a 5 min job with a hacksaw. Trim the 1/4" off the front of the rubber mount (the narrow end of the taper) and clean it up with a quick sanding on a belt sander. Once installed you will never see it but the belt sander does a nice job of tidying it up.
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bally
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, thanks.

Dave
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