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My 48-49 make over.
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johnshenry Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is the door not closed all the way??
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BUGBOY1976
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnshenry wrote:
Is the door not closed all the way??


Appears that way Rolling Eyes
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BUGBOY1976
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Removed the interior handles today.
As they are chrome and this car is a Standard model with painted bumpers and hubcaps I would presume the interior handles to be painted.

Correct me if you think i'm wrong as I'm no expert. Confused

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From what I understand is the window crank is not suited to my car as the knob is black and should be brown.
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Blauchen L331
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't you say your car came from Switzerland???? Originally sold there???? Or am I mixing your car up with another 48 or 49?

If the car was SOLD/DELIVERED outside of Germany, then it's an Export Standard and ALL handles, bumpers and hubcaps were chromed.

Just "inland" Standard cars and certain cars of the Military forces were all painted parts......and there were exceptions to just chrome headlight and taillight rings chrome only as well. Smile

Chromed early parts (like your handles) are very rare, oh and the 1948 inside door knobs were black, not brown.

Only the large dash switches were brown colored bakelite, the same color as the dashboard pod itself.

Well, another thing is I've noticed that you've painted all your outside handles grey, so it would be EASIER to just strip the interior handles of their chrome and paint them grey to match the rest of the car, the knob just stays black and the car's then as correct as the paint can be, you just have minor details on this car to finish, you have really done a great job! Smile

Wish I could have an late 48/early 49 in any way, inland/export/military, who cares as long as it's complete!!!!! Your car has all the rare bits already, so the hard part is done! Wink


Tom
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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BUGBOY1976
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your information Tom.
I went and checked the paper work I have and here is a copy of the birth certificate.

I'll try translate the text but you may understand it anyway.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


ok this is best I could do. Don't know how to type that funny looking B in StoBstangen. ???


"because it is in their vehicle for a standard model Handell, were not bumpers and chrome hub caps"

I take it that none of the bumpers, handles or hub caps are chrome so they then must be painted.
I could be wrong I'm learning as I go on this one.
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Blauchen L331
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUGBOY1976 wrote:
Thanks for your information Tom.
I went and checked the paper work I have and here is a copy of the birth certificate.

I'll translate the text soon but you may understand it anyway.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ohh it says that "Standard cars didn't have chromed bumpers or hubcaps!" ~ well yeah they didn't not in Germany (German sold cars).

Dr Wiersch doesn't know what the hell he's talking about, LOL!!!!!!! I met him back in 1988 (he was a very nice person) , BUT we did get into a heated discussion once in Manheim Veterama about how WRONG many cars are in the Factory Museum, I also asked him for a job there so it could be corrected, (he just laughed and said they don't have the money to make everything correct, which is totall bullshit)
Really it seems that VW really doesn't care so much about parts on a car being correct, just that it's shiny enough to display in a museum........

So yeah, your car came from Switzerland, built 12 Jan. 1949 and the original color was grey.

So your car is a Standard Export, the car was "dolled" up and made pretty for export purposes.

So all the painted stuff isn't how the car was to start off with and those CHROMED interior door handles ARE original!!!!!

Terry Schuler had an ex-Swiss Very Early 1949 car JUST like yours, (WITH ALL CHROMED EXTERIOR PARTS) it's a famous car, it was sold to that Carl Belcher and then when he passed away to was sold to the San Francisco area, I'm SURE someone here knows about that car, it is a beautiful L37 Medium Blue with the "striped" flannel looking original interior.

Herman Walter has a 1948 Dutch car that's a grey one, which also has all the exterior parts chromed. (that car comes to German shows).

The 1947 to 1949 Export Standard had the following parts chromed:

Exterior -

Front and Rear bumpers and guards

Kubelwagen 3-point horn cover/some cars had Sprial Designed covers, just the cover and the screws holding it down were chromed.

Hood L-handle

Headlight rings

Hubcaps with BIG VW emblem

Door handles

Motor Decklid L-handle

Chrome ring around taillights


Interior -

Door Handles (both)

That was it.

Your car also would have had a Medium/Dark Red wheel hub with Grey outer rims.

VW emblem on chrome hubcap would have been black.

That's how a Grey 1948/49 Banana Bumpered Split Window VW was delivered to the Swiss Car Dealers.

If you want it to represent an original Swiss car you have lot's more chroming and detailing to do.

Since the cars come so far as it is, I'd restore it as a "inland" or a military standard and just keep the original interior handles chrome, or just buy a set of painted ones, keep the original one's chromed in case down the road you want to spend all that money chroming and re- detailing etc.


Tom
_________________
OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR


Last edited by Blauchen L331 on Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:07 am; edited 5 times in total
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usariemen
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It says: "Due to have been a standard, the bumpers and hubcaps where not chromed."

Wrong to me and not the first time the factory does not know anymore about their own stuff.

As it was delivered to swizzerland in 1949, it surely had the "early export" chrome package.
Like that:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here are 1949 swiss import cars:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


So the door openers and window cranks are the originals from your car I believe. Leave them as they are. Or put them in storage and take others, less rare ones and paint them to match the rest of the actual state of your car.
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Blauchen L331
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, the same good advice! Smile from usariemen

Dammmm that shot with the cars lined up under the trees is KRAZY!!!!!!!! (they look to be lighter than the normal L255 jupiter grey are they L21 pearl grey???)

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Wunderbar!!!!!!

Sick, ok boys just drive them all over to my house there's free bier and schnitzel!!!!! Wink

BugBoy I love your car!!!! I'll trade you my Euro Oval and One Kidney for it, LOL!!!!!!!!
Surprised

Tom

PS. Ohh usariemen were the Swiss Exported cars L21 pearl grey???(LIGHT GREY) I know Herman Walter's Dutch car is????? - that darker grey was used on US Army Standards L 255 jupiter grey???? ~ And all colors then were Nitro-Lacquer as well......something not too many paintshops will shoot anymore.
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shocked Ok so from what I now understand is the detail on the certificate is not actual fact documented on the car but the opinion of the person whom processed the certificate at the time. Rolling Eyes
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usariemen
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blauchen L331 wrote:


PS. Ohh usariemen were the Swiss Exported cars L21 pearl grey???(LIGHT GREY) I know Herman Walter's Dutch car is?????


I did not take the pics personally, so I´m not sure about the color. Wink
I know the car from Hermann Walter, a good example.
But I think it came back from Belgium?
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm starting to feel like I've just taken two steps backwards here right now. Sad

I also have here a early document which has some details. I believe it to be first rego papers.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUGBOY1976 wrote:
Shocked Ok so from what I now understand is the detail on the certificate is not actual fact documented on the car but the opinion of the person whom processed the certificate at the time. Rolling Eyes


No no that's an true factory document from the 1980's or 90's but someone just added their personal two cents which wasn't worth that much....

Tom
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

usariemen wrote:
Blauchen L331 wrote:


PS. Ohh usariemen were the Swiss Exported cars L21 pearl grey???(LIGHT GREY) I know Herman Walter's Dutch car is?????


I did not take the pics personally, so I´m not sure about the color. Wink
I know the car from Hermann Walter, a good example.
But I think it came back from Belgium?


oHH YES so sorry!!!!!! Belgium, his grey car is Belgian, my mistake, I was overwhelmed by the cars beauty, I couldn't tell the letter B Wink

Tom
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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Blauchen L331
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUGBOY1976 wrote:
I'm starting to feel like I've just taken two steps backwards here right now. Sad

I also have here a early document which has some details. I believe it to be first rego papers.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


oHH NO you have a beautiful car, it's just some details and well how many people in the modern VW scene have ever seen or even heard of a Swiss 1949 Export Standard????

Your car has mostly all the rare parts already there and I'd say it's all up to how you want the car to be, it's looking very original and correct partswise, how many people would know a Swiss car EVEN ORIGINALLY HAD chrome bumpers????

Just to have an original car of your quality and completeness on that side of the world is a real accomplishment bravo!

So don't feel bad about some color changes or small details, like I mentioned, buy some extra newer Standard interior door handles and paint them grey, install them and your detailing is nearly done....

Ohh BTW that Swiss Import paperwork is kool as hell, I'd give eye teeth and first born if I had any original paperwork like that for my Euro Oval.

Tom
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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BUGBOY1976
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As it turns out I do have a spare set of handles so I'll be keeping the chrome ones as they are. I also have another pair of chrome headlight rings.
The door handles where not originals for the car when I got it so I also have other handles which would look correct. Leaves me to just having to chrome the bumpers and hubcaps I guess. I might enjoy my painted bits for a while but I do plan to have it correct one day.

After posting the last paper I started thinking it was the import paper.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BUGBOY1976 wrote:
As it turns out I do have a spare set of handles so I'll be keeping the chrome ones as they are. I also have another pair of chrome headlight rings.
The door handles where not originals for the car when I got it so I also have other handles which would look correct. Leaves me to just having to chrome the bumpers and hubcaps I guess. I might enjoy my painted bits for a while but I do plan to have it correct one day.

After posting the last paper I started thinking it was the import paper.


Yeah, a little chrome and your there.... Smile

Yes, that last paper is the original IMPORT papers, very kool!!!

Car came over Schaffhausen Rail Station and then it went to whatever Canton/City they sold it in? Basel Maybe?

They have the interior as blue, it's that blue-greyish flannel striped looking material they used 19547 to 1949 (early) .

Tom
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OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes I started to figure that the door handles would most likely be the originals as they are never really swapped out from cars. I'll put them aside till a later date.
I got a phone call from Volkswagen today and they are collecting thier car on Friday. I only sold my 89 model caravelle the week before and I have had a few people say to me while out and about "Bit of an up grade I see" Laughing

They also spoke about helping out with the work that was done just before they collected my car.
I think they where very pleased with the car as they said it got a lot of interest at the launch.
I have to say they have been really great with the whole thing.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am just starting to gather all the detail and correct information for the restoration of a 1946 and marvel the information posted above!

Who knows all of this for sure?
Do we know someone who worked at VW in Wolfsburg in the late 1940s with a perfect memory?
Or has someone actually got documentation giving irrefutable proof to confirm these details?

Whilst the above posters may be 100% correct wouldn’t it be nice to see the documentary proof published here on The Samba. It would save us all a lot of time and maybe money.

I love my Volkswagens and have done so for the last forty five years but have always found that whatever is said by one person will be disputed by another. ‘Progressive Refinements’ is a great source but there have been occasions when that has been brought into doubt. Actual proven original and irrefutable documents and photographs have always been elusive.

My personal opinion would answer NO to most of my questions. We are all good speculators but will never know for sure the exact specification of each car as it left the factory.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there's enough original pre 1950 cars left in the world to document the changes often explained here at the Samba, even WW2 KDF cars there's enough of them that survived mostly intact and have been preserved by the likes of the Grundmann Family and Herman Walter (who's 1948 car is one of the best documented cars in the world).

I think that most of the people, myself included who have posted advice and tips here have been very correct in what consists of the original stats of a January 1949 Swiss car.

Production between July 1945 to about the same time in 1950, was a really wild crazy ride at VW, they really didn't get it all together in mass production without great snags, untill 1950/51 era, by that time the German Postwar Wonder Economy was just starting to get into gear and by 1953/54 VW was one of the leading car makers in the world. Smile

Tom
_________________
OG PAINT L331 1957 TYPE 1 OVAL WINDOW
(US Navy In Germany/ Special Ordered Car from MAHAG Munich)
Delivered with Semaphores - German "Puntchen" Cloth Polkadotted Interior -
USA RAM Protection/Export Overrider Bumpers - MPH Speedometer -
Sealed Beam Headlights and Bullet Front Turn Signals!
99.9% ORIGINAL PARTS WITH ONLY 36,500 ORIGINAL MILES/ GARAGE FIND/ UNRESTORED CAR
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom, I am not doubting the research that you and many others have done over the years but...

I remember the early 1970s when there was little interest in very early Volkswagens, I myself owned a 1949 Beetle in 1972. Then there were just a few enthusiasts trying to keep a running car on the road. There were also some that were everyday cars whose originality did not matter to the owners.
In that period and the ten or so years before most of these cars went through a 'low' period in their life and suffered many changes, mods and so called upgrades which defaced their originality but kept them going.
My '49 (1-101991) had been 'modernised' with side trims, internal bonnet (sorry, front hood) latch and other alterations including a fold down gear lever for easy movement of the driver across the car!
The '46 was last used in the early 1960s as some type of competition car I believe. It has many holes where all kinds of items have been fixed not to mention rivets in the roof where some type of rack has been fitted!
This all indicates to me that what we think is unmolested could be doubtful.

On one simple point that someone has mentioned above, that the early wiring looms were cloth covered. The main loom that I have extracted from the ’46 is definitely plastic covered, I believe it to be the original but who knows for sure? I will replace it with a plastic covered one that I bought from a genuine VW source many years ago so to me that is as near correct as I can get.
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