| Author |
Message |
Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9797
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
|
 Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
 |
|
| Babin wrote: |
Warm (15 minutes) idle : 2-5 psi
Warm 2500 rpm 20-25 psi
Warm 4000 psi 25-30 psi
What do you think? |
Warm pressures are little on the low side - will possibly be lower still on a thoroughly hot engine.
Pertinent questions might include -
What weight oil are you running?
What brand oil filter are you using? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
jberger
Samba Member
Joined: November 17, 2003
Posts: 2476
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 1:37 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| I don't recall, did you replace rod bearings? Day late and a dollar short.. but I always check oil pressure on any van that has any mechanical issue before tearing it down. To me it means the difference between feeling comfortable about a top end only or needing to split the case. These pressures are low. Put in Mobil 1 15w50 and an oil cooler. It will raise the pressures when hot and prolong the life of your engine. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:27 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
I didn't felt confortable splitting the case, so I didn't change the rod bearing. I check for travel as much as I could, seems fine, but I'm no expert.
I see drop of oil coming from the flywheel end of the engine when idling. Wouldn't that be related to low oil pressure?
I'm on Castrol 20W50 oil and the filter is a Mann. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:32 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| jberger wrote: |
| Day late and a dollar short.. but I always check oil pressure on any van that has any mechanical issue before tearing it down. To me it means the difference between feeling comfortable about a top end only or needing to split the case. |
Since one of the piston had seize piston ring and the compression was going to the base, there was so much oil pressure that it was coming out of the dipstick tube and flying off the filling tube when open, I don't think it was possible to get a good feel about it by measuring the oil pressure. The very high oil pressure was actually how I realize the engine was toasted. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gruppe B
Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2007
Posts: 1331
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:40 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| Babin wrote: |
| jberger wrote: |
| Day late and a dollar short.. but I always check oil pressure on any van that has any mechanical issue before tearing it down. To me it means the difference between feeling comfortable about a top end only or needing to split the case. |
Since one of the piston had seize piston ring and the compression was going to the base, there was so much oil pressure that it was coming out of the dipstick tube and flying off the filling tube when open, I don't think it was possible to get a good feel about it by measuring the oil pressure. The very high oil pressure was actually how I realize the engine was toasted. |
I think you are confusing crankcase pressure with oil pressure. Oil at the dipstick is not under pressure |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32574
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 4:47 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Thanks Dave,
So, if I understand right, I have to take it apart again and change the rod bearing.
Would it be a good idea to take the two weeks of vacation left and enjoy the van and then in the fall take the engine off and play again. Or will it hurt to drive it around a couple of thousands Km this summer and it should park it until then?
Would a pressure relief valve refresh help in any way? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32574
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9797
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:14 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
I do not have experience with this on the WBX engine - but on my other engines I have found that main bearings last a very long time as they are not subject to great forces.
Con rod bearings OTOH take a beating by comparison and get replaced anytime the pan (again not WBX) is off.
So it is quite possible just con rod bearings will make a difference.
Low oil pressure is a far cry from no oil pressure. It is somewhat like a heart beat -- real important to have one, after that some are better then others.
It is a gamble but driving these things is that anyway. I expect many (who do not have an oil pressure gauge) drive around with pressure that would be a concern if only they knew. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| Wouldn't the light and buzzer come on if it had too low oil pressure? To the point where it could damage the engine.... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:44 am Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Another strange observation. While the mechanic was doing the front suspensions, I pulled the valve cover off to adjust the valve (once more now that it had run for twice about 30 minutes) and a lot of oil came off from the pushrod tube once the valve cover was off. I mean a lot, it just kept on dripping. Is that sign of something in particular?
I know what you think, and yes I will be taking the van to a vanagon specialist, now that the van can run. I just have to wait until they open back from the summer holidays. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32574
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mikemtnbike
Samba Member
Joined: March 26, 2015
Posts: 2795
Location: North Carolina
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 10:47 am Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
babin- I'm sure you're getting frustrated by now. Just want you to know I really appreciate your posting, this thread is getting bookmarked by me as I've delayed pulling my motor for waterjacket leak via the wonderful world of Subaru Coolant Conditioner. Too hot to camp now, so time to do.
Your seeking of information is helpful to others like me.
Ahwanee, djkeev, jberger, other gurus- thanks for all your feedback to OP.
_________________
1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled  https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
2020 GTI SE manual |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:21 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Here is a pic of my oil pressure gauge, I went with mount-in. It's ok but the side view of the gauge end up overestimating the value while in driving position. Not so bad when you are aware of it.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
To end the spring saga I (mostly the mechanic) finally finish the front end today as planned. Replacing the front bushing, ball joints (upper and lower), springs and shock ended up being a 13 hours job for the mechanic with me as a helper.
The van got level and I think the back when down a bit because it doesn't look that high anymore. I would say it lifted overall about over an inch just like van cafe website says.
Have a look at my stock spring and the go west «stock» (zero lift) spring, impressive isn't it?
I actually found a fade with tag in the grey paint stating they're all were zero lift, so no gowesty screw up on the order.
Last edited by Babin on Sat Jul 30, 2016 5:32 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9797
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:45 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Wow, an extra coil and more height - if that is what they sell as Zero Lift then I would think they need to explain what the term means.
At least now yours sits level. Hopefully it fits in garage... proceed slowly and remember that the skylight is usually the high spot. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| Ahwahnee wrote: |
| Wow, an extra coil and more height - if that is what they sell as Zero Lift then I would think they need to explain what the term means. |
An extra and a half coil to be more precise..... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
IdahoDoug
Samba Member
Joined: June 12, 2010
Posts: 10248
Location: N. Idaho
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:27 pm Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Wow, that does NOT look like zero lift to my eyes. Hope other things get resolved for you. Post if you have more questions.
_________________
1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Babin
Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2016
Posts: 166
Location: Québec, Canada
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 12:46 am Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
Interesting.... I just found this.
Gowesty page for Rear Coil Springs - 2WD «ZERO LIFT: These are designed as a direct replacement for all 1980-91 Vanagon 2WD Westfalia campers and will maintain your factory ride height. If you have the much lighter hard-top Vanagon (or single/double cab truck), you will see a slight suspension lift of up to 1.5". If you have an engine conversion that has a different weight or weight distribution—something other than the Vanagon water-boxer engine—your Vanagon may not sit level. These springs are NOT designed to compensate for Vanagons with engine conversions. If you need additional leveling, we offer spring pads (see the related items section below).»
Gowesty site for Front Coil Springs - 2WD: «ZERO LIFT: These are designed as a direct replacement for all 1980-91 Vanagon 2WD Westfalia campers, and will maintain your factory ride height. If you have the much lighter hard-top Vanagon (or single/double cab truck), you will see a slight suspension lift of up to 1.5". Keep in mind that certain models of Vanagon (like the Carat) have factory lowering springs, and they sit 1.5" to 2" lower than standard camper models; thus, these zero lift springs will actually lift your vehicle about 1.5" to 2" overall!»
I ordered the rear springs only in 2015 and never planned to changed front springs, until the rear got so jack up. So I just learn my van had factory lowering springs. No wonder these new one were so hard to fit in there. Wish I had knew that before. I guess it explain why these were so much taller. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ahwahnee
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010
Posts: 9797
Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
|
| Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 8:16 am Post subject: Re: July 2016 engine job ~ 1991 Vanagon Multivan |
|
|
| GoWesty wrote: |
| Keep in mind that certain models of Vanagon (like the Carat) have factory lowering springs... |
| Babin wrote: |
| ...So I just learn my van had factory lowering springs. No wonder these new one were so hard to fit in there. Wish I had knew that before. I guess it explain why these were so much taller. |
Typical Westy:
Typical Carat:
But I do not know how a Multivan is supposed to sit. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
