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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:42 am Post subject: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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Guys,
I replaced the fuel sending unit on my '68 Beetle a few months ago. I recetly noticed that when I top the tank up there is a slight amount of gasoline seeping around the seal. I've made sure it is snugged down, but I think the seals on the bolts may be the issue.
I ordered a kit from aircooled.net that was supposed to come with washers. Instead, it was just the gasket itself. When contacted, they said it was a mixup on the part number and that they didn't have any kits with washers.
I've done enough research to know I should have 4 plastic washers and one copper washer, correct? My question is: where can I get replacements? Is there something I can buy locally that will work instead? I saw a post somewhere about a guy using rubber o-rings for each bolt. I've also read where you can use copper washers on each, because they will deform/crush and make a seal.
Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated. I'm going to try to run by some auto parts stores at lunch today to find something, so any advice I can get ASAP would be most welcome.
I've got the gasket and would really like to get it fixed this weekend. Thanks in advance! |
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runamoc Samba Member
Joined: June 19, 2006 Posts: 5600 Location: 37.5N 77.1W
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:39 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
supposed to come with washers |
'Regular' washers work. To stop the leak, use some sealant, NOT RTV, and put alittle dab on the screw threads before installing them.
_________________ Daily driver: '69 Baja owned 44 yrs - Plan B: '81 Rabbit Diesel LS Deluxe - Plan C: '72 Ghia
Yard Art: 2 Sandrails
Outback: '69 Ghia - '68,'69,'70,'72 Beetle - '84 Scirocco, GTI - Pair of '02 Golfs-
VW Wiring = It's just wires |
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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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runamoc Samba Member
Joined: June 19, 2006 Posts: 5600 Location: 37.5N 77.1W
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:19 am Post subject: |
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I guess that would work. Best way to put it on the gasket is put the sealant on and rub it in back and forth with a finger and thumb for a thin coat. _________________ Daily driver: '69 Baja owned 44 yrs - Plan B: '81 Rabbit Diesel LS Deluxe - Plan C: '72 Ghia
Yard Art: 2 Sandrails
Outback: '69 Ghia - '68,'69,'70,'72 Beetle - '84 Scirocco, GTI - Pair of '02 Golfs-
VW Wiring = It's just wires |
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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:21 am Post subject: |
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Did you put any sealant on the gasket or just the bolt threads? Do you recall what you used on the threads? |
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jlex Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2009 Posts: 2902 Location: NW Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:42 am Post subject: |
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Had the same problem on my '70 after replacing the gasket. Cured it 100% by using neoprene O rings just under the heads of the bolts... I'd try that before smearing any type of sealant around there; if it gets into the tank that could be a problem. _________________ jlex.
'70 std. "Elsie"
'88 Carrera |
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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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Where were you able to find neoprene o-rings? |
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jlex Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2009 Posts: 2902 Location: NW Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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mrdctaylor wrote: |
Where were you able to find neoprene o-rings? |
I ordered them from Ebay. They measure 9.75mm OD x 6.25mm ID.
I put the O ring down onto the flange first, then the nylon washer next, then the bolt goes thru the two and screws into the flange. Works perfect for me. Absolutely NO fume smell even after a fill-up.
I'll be out of town until the 22nd, after which I can mail some to you if you send me your address by PM. _________________ jlex.
'70 std. "Elsie"
'88 Carrera |
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jlex Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2009 Posts: 2902 Location: NW Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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Just for the record: they're Viton hard 90 O rings from Jet Gasket & Seal Co. wwwjetgasket.com But like I said, I have enough to share so just PM me your address. _________________ jlex.
'70 std. "Elsie"
'88 Carrera |
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jgrexx Samba Member
Joined: July 19, 2012 Posts: 342 Location: Alabama
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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mine just has metal washers and they seal fine. they should concave to fit the holes when you tighten the screws down. if they stay straight and don't bend then they won't seal properly. you may need some thinner washers that bend easier. i noticed when i changed my gasket it's real easy for the gasket not to sit flat on the part where there's a slot in the gasket. there is sortof a square piece on the underside of the sending unit that the gasket can catch the lip of which will keep it from sealing properly. i hope that makes sense. make sure the gasket is not catching the edge of the square part. make sure it sits flat. _________________ 1970 Baja Bug
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=520964&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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jlex Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2009 Posts: 2902 Location: NW Pennsylvania
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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I'd have to say the whole problem is that the flange metal is thin & cheaply made. Because its not sitting flush with the washers you have to maybe deform the washers to seal like jgrexx says or use O rings to accommodate the sloppy fit. _________________ jlex.
'70 std. "Elsie"
'88 Carrera |
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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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jlex wrote: |
Just for the record: they're Viton hard 90 O rings from Jet Gasket & Seal Co. wwwjetgasket.com But like I said, I have enough to share so just PM me your address. |
Thanks, man. I bought some washers and stuff. I'll give it a whirl with what I have. If I still can't get it to seal I'll definitely PM you. THANKS! |
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mrdctaylor Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2011 Posts: 76
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 8:06 am Post subject: |
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So far so good! I did the following on Saturday morning:
1) VERY lightly coated new rubber gasket with Permatex 2. I used very little as I didn't want any to squeeze out and get in the fuel tank. Basically I put on rubber gloves smeared a little on both sides and then rubbed off as much as I could with my fingers.
2) I put a small metal washer on each new bolt and then followed it with a small o-ring that I got from NAPA. I then put just a bit of the Permatex 2 on the threads of the bolts. Again, I used very little. I didn't want to take any chance of it getting into the gas.
3) I put everything together. No Permatex was squeezed out around the gasket which was good to see. Just a tiny bit came out around the heads of the bolts, but not much. Basically, just whatever worked its way up from threading the bolts in.
4) I let everything sit for about 36 hours and then filled the gas tank up to the top.
I drove it around for 10 minutes and checked. Dry as a bone. This was all it took for it to begin seeping before. I went out about an hour later and checked. Still no seepage. Checked again this morning. Still good to go.
Permatex 2 is supposed to be fuel resistant, so I'm hoping I've fixed this for good. I'll report back here if something changes, but I'm hoping I've fixed this one and for all. FWIW, that Permatex appears to be good stuff. It doesn't "harden" as per the packaging but it definitely cures to a pretty solid (but flexible and not sticky) substance.
Edit: Several days later and everything is still perfectly dry. Hopefully I have it fixed for good now. Live and learn. |
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apensity Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2014 Posts: 208 Location: Chico, CA
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Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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mrdctaylor wrote: |
Several days later and everything is still perfectly dry. Hopefully I have it fixed for good now. Live and learn. |
Is it still working? I just got a '74 this weekend, everything new, but a MAJOR leak on the sending unit. The entire unit is sitting in a puddle of gas, makes me a little worried since this will be my daughter's bug soon!
I am going to follow your directions tomorrow and try to seal it up. Did you have to cmpletely remove the sending unit to seal the gasket? I'm thinking about just trying to put some permatex on the screw threads and put on the orings and washers and seeing if it works so I don't have to take apart the sending unit as well. THanks for a great thread!!! |
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Dismas Samba Member
Joined: September 16, 2010 Posts: 184 Location: Reno, NV
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Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:42 am Post subject: Re: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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Apensity.
Removing the sending unit is a trivial addition to just pulling the screws, and, since this car will be driven by your daughter, it seems silly to me to half - err, way it.
Go buy a new gasket, get some of that permatex, and do it up right. You will like yourself better for doing it right. _________________ 69/70 chop refurbed from a 70 baja |
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apensity Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2014 Posts: 208 Location: Chico, CA
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Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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I've tried looking for info on how to pull the unit. Is it just pulling the screws and pulling out the send, slipping the new gasket on, then screwing it back in (with new washers and o-rings as OP stated)? Or do I need to empty the tank, or do anything major? Sorry, I've grow up in my Dad's autoshop, but he never let me work on any fuel related systems, so I'm a little sketchy when it comes to them. But I can rebuild your front-end if you need it! |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31362 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 5:27 pm Post subject: Re: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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apensity wrote: |
I've tried looking for info on how to pull the unit. Is it just pulling the screws and pulling out the send, slipping the new gasket on, then screwing it back in (with new washers and o-rings as OP stated)? |
Yes, you may need to angle the sender out and then back in, so pay attention, be cautious of gasoline flammability.
Supers are trickier, the sender there rotates in. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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andrewvwclassic Samba Member
Joined: January 25, 2012 Posts: 920 Location: los angeles
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Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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runamoc wrote: |
I guess that would work. Best way to put it on the gasket is put the sealant on and rub it in back and forth with a finger and thumb for a thin coat. |
+1 those neoprin washers are garbage they protrude to far fml. My sender came w/ a set, I threw them out and used rtv. Old sender did not anything but the rubber seal and the car drove 45 years no problem, so I was not too concerened when when I read this thread. The amount of fluid coming out would be so minute. Worst come to worse do not top your tank off soo high. |
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6598 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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I tried these but the ID seems to be too large as when I screwed the screw in some of the gasket came out the edge. I tried another and seemed to fit.
https://www.mcmaster.com/mv1490296384/#90133a013/=16wg5oz
I'll check tomorrow to see if it is still leaking. |
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apensity Samba Member
Joined: July 07, 2014 Posts: 208 Location: Chico, CA
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Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:52 pm Post subject: Re: Gas seeping from fuel sending unit seal--washers to use? |
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Awesome, thanks! _________________ 1974 Standard Beetle, 1835cc with A/C... pure fun |
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