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Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project
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Aerindel
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2016 2:01 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Just have to say, keep up the good work. I've been watching this thread for what? A year now? and it has to be one of most detailed I've ever seen and I really enjoy reading not just what you've done, but how you go about figuring it out, and of course the "budget" part makes it actually interesting since I pretty much just ignore the "throw money at it" builds as that is out of my league.

Makes me want to get back into something fun like my rail. I haven't even had it out since the snow melted.....for some reason I decided that I wanted to turn a 2000 subaru outback into....well, I don't know what you would call it....a battle wagon? And I got in too deep before I know what I was doing. I've spent the last month doing battle with the mysteries of the multi-link rear suspension and trying to figure out how to do a suspension lift on it without just paying someone a thousand dollars to do it for me. (and lacking a covered work area, the rain) But I really want to get back to something that I can understand just by looking at it, and where you can weld onto any part of it.

And also...a more open community. Seems anyone who knows anything about subaru suspension mods is keeping it secret so they can sell it, and everyone else doesn't know the difference between caster and camber.

Hey, at least it is a four cylinder boxer right?
_________________
Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2016 3:16 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

If the Scooby turns out to be a bust, all isn't lost. You'll still have a spare drive train for the rail (some assembly required LOL).

FWIW, I've been keeping an eye on CL for a rusted out out, but well running, 90-94 Subaru for the drive train. The 90-94 Subaru EJ20 (or 22?) is OBD1 (simpler than OBD2) and is a non-interference fit engine. If your timing belt slips or snaps (somewhat common failure) on the non-interference engine, the valves won't hit the pistons and destroy the engine. Wink

IMHO, the simplest way to adapt one of the Subaru engines and trans assemblies to the rail would be to mount it as a mid engine setup. Then you get a 5 speed and don't have to mess with trans adapters and flipping the ring gear in a VW trans or buying a reverse rotation R&P gear set for the Suby trans. All of those options cost a lot more than my budget can handle. Making a mid mount would just require new engine and trans mounts and swapping out the drive cups on the trans to fit VW or Porsche CVs. This would be easiest to do on a new frame as you're building it. The donor car would have pretty much everything else needed for the swap.

WOW! I just noticed this thread has just hit 20 pages! It doesn't seem like I've done 20 pages worth of progress yet though. Laughing
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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Aerindel
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2016 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Quote:
All of those options cost a lot more than my budget


Mine too. as cheap as subaru's are up here it actually mad more sense for me to modify an outback to be more like a buggy than the other way around.

Quote:
If your timing belt slips or snaps (somewhat common failure) on the non-interference engine, the valves won't hit the pistons and destroy the engine. Wink


Yeah...been there, done that. Doesn't totally destroy the engine, the pistons are usually fine, but it bends the valves and wrecks the valve guides. This is why the first thing I do when I buy a subaru is replacing the timing belt and more importantly...the tensioner, which is in my experience fails before the belt does.

But yeah, the old subaru's would be better but I have more luck finding 2000+ ones for cheap up here. You can snatch up one with a blown engine for $400, and another with a wrecked body for the same amount and swap the engine in a weekend and have a pretty good car.

It actually seems like its cheaper to buy a subaru and cut it down into a buggy than to make a buggy street legal.
_________________
Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 9:14 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Well, it's in the mid 60's and dry right now and the rain isn't supposed to come back until after 5PM. Looks like it's finally time to get back to work on finishing up the tunnel.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 2:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I got a couple of minor sprinkles falling on me while I was working outside, but not enough to stop what I was doing. In the end it was my back killing me that had me calling it a day, even though I still had some nice weather left outside. I'm just going to post the pics from today with some short notes above them.

Tunnel top fitted and bolted down.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Made a couple holes for the shifter and ground down the bumps keeping it from sitting flat.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Test fit of the shifter looks good.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Set the tunnel in the rail. The hockey stick and the roller gas pedal shaft were keeping it from fitting where it is supposed to go. I measured the hockey stick location and drilled a 1.25" opening with a hole saw.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Pic of the gas pedal interference in relation to the tunnel. I need to move the pedals anyway, so I'll address the clearance issue when I do that.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I haven't been able to get out to work on the rail lately due to my back acting up. Doesn't help my knee injury is giving me heck right now as well. The knee acting up again is bothering me in a large part due to the doc telling me that I should get surgery on it. Sad

Anyway, I just sold my dual cannons so I was able to get a speedometer for the rail with the money I got. Here's the link to the Ebay auction for the speedo. http://www.ebay.com/itm/282020995994 I'll see how well I can translate the chinglish instructions whenever it gets here. Laughing
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Well, so much for that idea... Rolling Eyes
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_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I was poking around the web a bit tonight and came across this FG seat. (Style C)
http://markvfiberglass.com/seat-c-universal-reinforced-solar-round-bottom-seat-shell-only/
It looks like almost a perfect match for the seats I have in my rail right now. I'll give them a call on Monday to see if they can recommend a place to find a seat cover that fits these seats.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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Q13931152
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 11:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Looks like a pretty generic fiberglass seat so most any high back cover should fit.
http://www.appletreeauto.com/HIGH-BACK-COVER-BLACK-AC851101C/
Just one possibility, but the mfg should know for sure what works.
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2016 3:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

DON'T DO IT!!!! Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation

http://markvfiberglass.com/seat-c-universal-reinforced-solar-round-bottom-seat-shell-only/
[img]
http://cdn6.bigcommerce.com/s-jxinw/products/178/i...?c=2[/img]

I used seats just like those in my rail back in the mid-70s. They were comfy with 2" of stiff foam padding on the bottom and 1" for the on top of that for the whole seat. In fact one of the 1" full seat pads from one of those is in the way in my garage right now. I was thinking this morning that I need to find a new use for it. Those seats came out of the car because after a time of driving or riding in the car offroad, one has a serious raw sore spot at the tail bone. Some got blisters during a race. The cross bar groove where the seat back meets the bottom is the danger. I decided that was telling me that a hard hit or crash landing had the potential to crush the spine. It's tight in my frame for suspension seats, so I installed poly seats. They're still there, although I would rather have suspension seats.

You have made it clear in this thread and your mirror one on STF-ORF that existing back trouble and concerns about aggravating that rule many of your decisions on this car and it's planned replacement. So please DON'T Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation buy those seats. You could have mine and the mounts for them for the cost of shipping them to you if I were not concerned about their safety.
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Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
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Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 6:31 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Richard, I think you misunderstood the post above with the link to the seats. I put that link up there to show that I had finally found the manufacturer of the seats that came with my rail. I am ok with the way these seats feel with the 5-6" of extra memory type foam seat padding in the bottom of the seat that a PO had placed in there. The forward lean that the seat back felt like it had was my biggest complaint with them. I'm addressing that issue when I reinstall those seats in the rail. I really just need some new seat covers to replace the old, stiff and torn covers I have now.

I'd love to get some suspension seats to replace them, but this frame I have now is too narrow to fit any of the ones I've looked at so far. When I replace the frame, I will be getting a wider one so I can fit whichever seats I want to put in there. That's when I'm planning to do the seat upgrade to suspension seats.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2016 9:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Do your existing seats have the cross support tube notch formed at the meeting of the seat bottom with the seat back like the Mark V ones and mine? That is the issue in those seats.

Even with 5" of padding, I'm concerned about contact with that.

And make sure your seat mount bolts have the heads to the inside and the tips to the outside.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2016 2:43 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

dustymojave wrote:
Do your existing seats have the cross support tube notch formed at the meeting of the seat bottom with the seat back like the Mark V ones and mine? That is the issue in those seats.

Do you have a pic of this area? I don't think mine have anything like that, but I'll get some better pics of that area of my seats and post them so you can see how mine look compared to yours.

You mentioned "Mark V", so maybe mine are an older version of those seats (Mk I through IV?). They do have somewhat factory looking seat belt slots cut in them at the shoulders that I don't see in the current seat pics on the website.

dustymojave wrote:
And make sure your seat mount bolts have the heads to the inside and the tips to the outside.

That's the plan. I'd hate to get "screwed" by a big pothole or something. Laughing
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2016 7:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I recently decided to put the rail on the back burner for a little bit while I build a two car carport attached to the barn. After this last tent fiasco I decided to just bite the bullet and build something a bit more substantial. That way I wouldn't have to worry about it every time the wind picked up and the leaves rattled a little bit. I'll attach it to the barn's North wall which is the one with the three windows visible in my latest pics. The West and North carport walls will be solid except maybe for a few windows. The East side will be open for now, but I'd like to get some big doors on that side before winter if possible. Most of the winds we get are from the North and the West anyway so it should be fine for a while with the East side left open. It will be the same width as the barn (20') and it will be 20' wide. There's a 100 year old tree in the way of the NW corner, so I'll have to zig zag the carport around it. I'll only have to move it over 4', so one parking spot will be 10' x 20' and the other side will be 10' x 16'.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 9:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

Even though the rail hasn't been getting as much attention as I would have liked to give it lately, I still have some small parts trickling in every now and then. I just received my speedometer/tachometer in the mail today and I'm still waiting on a windshield washer bottle kit to get here.

Here's a link to the speedometer on Ebay. It had a BIN price of $26.41 with free shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/282020995994?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT .

For the windshield washer bottle kit they didn't have a BIN at that time, just an auction. I got lucky and was able to get it for the opening bid of $0.99 with $14.99 for the shipping. Since I got mine, the seller has since changed their Ebay ad to a BIN format with the kit now going for $9.99, plus another $9.99 for shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-International-Wi...mp;vxp=mtr
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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notime2d8
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 8:39 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

GoMopar440 wrote:
Even though the rail hasn't been getting as much attention as I would have liked to give it lately, I still have some small parts trickling in every now and then. I just received my speedometer/tachometer in the mail today and I'm still waiting on a windshield washer bottle kit to get here.

Here's a link to the speedometer on Ebay. It had a BIN price of $26.41 with free shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/282020995994?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT .

For the windshield washer bottle kit they didn't have a BIN at that time, just an auction. I got lucky and was able to get it for the opening bid of $0.99 with $14.99 for the shipping. Since I got mine, the seller has since changed their Ebay ad to a BIN format with the kit now going for $9.99, plus another $9.99 for shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-International-Wi...mp;vxp=mtr



Any reason you went this route for a WW bottle and pump instead of grabbing one from a small car at the junkyard? Also, I saw another one mention to use only water, no soap? would that be for the pump or plastic?
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 10:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

notime2d8 wrote:
Any reason you went this route for a WW bottle and pump instead of grabbing one from a small car at the junkyard?

Most of the ones I found in the local (very small) JY were either destroyed or decayed too much to be of any use. I figured I'd just get a new one if I could find one cheap enough. For $16, I figured "Why not?".

notime2d8 wrote:
Also, I saw another one mention to use only water, no soap? would that be for the pump or plastic?

I don't know where you saw that comment, so I can't really say what someone else was thinking when they said that. Is that in reference to a plastic (lexan/acrylic(sp?)) windshield or is that comment referring to the plastic bottle/pump assembly. If it refers to the bottle/pump, That doesn't make very much sense to me.

I'll be using safety glass for my rail windshield, same as a regular car, so I plan to use regular WW fluid rather than water. The windshield and gasket will be sealed with the correct type of adhesive for that application, so I don't expect any problems from using the standard WW fluid.
_________________
Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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notime2d8
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

GoMopar440 wrote:
notime2d8 wrote:
Any reason you went this route for a WW bottle and pump instead of grabbing one from a small car at the junkyard?

Most of the ones I found in the local (very small) JY were either destroyed or decayed too much to be of any use. I figured I'd just get a new one if I could find one cheap enough. For $16, I figured "Why not?".

notime2d8 wrote:
Also, I saw another one mention to use only water, no soap? would that be for the pump or plastic?

I don't know where you saw that comment, so I can't really say what someone else was thinking when they said that. Is that in reference to a plastic (lexan/acrylic(sp?)) windshield or is that comment referring to the plastic bottle/pump assembly. If it refers to the bottle/pump, That doesn't make very much sense to me.

I'll be using safety glass for my rail windshield, same as a regular car, so I plan to use regular WW fluid rather than water. The windshield and gasket will be sealed with the correct type of adhesive for that application, so I don't expect any problems from using the standard WW fluid.




Both of these look the same as the one you purchased and have the warning:

CAUTION: Please use pure water, DO NOT USE soap water.

Doesn't make sense to me either but was wondering as I was planning on getting one too.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Universal-Classic-Car-...mp;vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Universal-12V-Car-Wind...mp;vxp=mtr
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:22 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

That's interesting about the "water only" note on those two ads you linked. From looking at the Ebay pictures, all the bottles appear to be the same, but the pump on the one I got looks different than the two you listed. I wonder if that's why the note wasn't in the ad for the one I got? Either way, I intend to run it with regular WW fluid.
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 12:18 am    Post subject: Re: Budget rail rebuild and dual carbs project Reply with quote

I was too worn out from my physical therapy appointment today so I skipped working on the carport project. Instead I did some design layout work for the dash to figure out the shape I wanted it to be and where I wanted the gauges to go. I had a thick old cardboard box laying around so I cut that up to make a pattern for the dash. I cut a two cardboard disks out of the scrap cardboard. I used a couple of hole saws that were close to the size of the two gauges I will be using. Those will be the LCD speedo/tach and the PLX DM-6 multi gauge. I'll be using idiot lights for the alt and oil, just like the old Bugs do. I put the shifter in the tunnel and slid it all the way forward. Then I moved the shifter all the way forward as well to check for clearance between the handle and the dash. So far so good. To place the circles for the gauge placement I sat in the drivers seat and held them up in front of the dash until I found a position that was easy to see. I stuck the circles on with some small nails to hold them in place until I could get the circles traced onto the dash pattern. On the pass side I'm planning to make a small glove box (not shown in pic yet) for registration, insurance and other misc stuff like that. It's not much progress, but it's more than I expected to get done today.
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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