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Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:55 pm

Hi all... new to the vw rail world.. and I'm loving it... anyways I would like you all to school me on my situation... picked up a rail.. assuming it's a 1600 dp by the engine code... anyways.. it's got a weber 32/36 dfav... but with an electric choke.. the choke is not hooked up to the main throttle linkage.. nor is the 12v hooked up... essentially it's totally disabled and wide open...anyways I can't get the damn thing to idle without having the idle speed screw turned in a bunch... messing with the idle mixture has no effect at all... with that being said... what's my next steps? Timing is correct. And do please school me... I am a 29 year old new age mechanic... carbs are just past me...

Sun Feb 07, 2016 11:15 pm

Not sure what your question is.

Obviously, fixing the choke is a good idea. Not only does it choke the engine, increasing vacuum and thus fuel mix on a cold engine, it also increases the idle speed. You need to hook up the linkage and plug in the choke, usually to the ignition terminal on the coil so it starts heating up as soon as your engine is running.

It also sounds like you may have a vacuum leak of some kind if your idle mix screw isn't having an effect. There is a vacuum port near the idle mix screw on the back of the carb that is often left open by people who don't know what its for (vacuum advance distributer) check to make sure that is either capped off or being used.

A few pictures of your carb and set up would help.

Also...read this thread. It was a huge help to me with my 32/36 when I was going through the same thing as you (no idea about carbs when I started)

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=386388

Mon Feb 08, 2016 9:29 am

So here's what I've found... 009 dizzy... vaccum ports plugs on carb... idle mixture has no effect on idle whatsoever... it will only run if I have the throttle pressed a little.

Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:22 am

http://www.redlineweber.com/html/Tech/carburetor_set_up_and_lean_best_.htm

Mon Feb 08, 2016 1:04 pm

Ya I try to follow those steps but it won't even idle at baseline without the throttle pressed part way.

Mon Feb 08, 2016 3:05 pm

Desertstrike86 wrote: Ya I try to follow those steps but it won't even idle at baseline without the throttle pressed part way.

Even with the engine warmed up?

Anyway, next step is to pull the primary idle jet and make sure it's not plugged.

Mon Feb 08, 2016 3:20 pm

Will do.. have a rebuild kit that came in the maIL today... gonna go through it.... I'm just wondering how the guy ran this rail without choke hooked up... and no return springs lol

Mon Feb 08, 2016 4:42 pm

Well, if you only run it on warm days you can get away without the choke, not that you should, its still hard to start, but not impossible. The return spring could have just been lost.

FYI, a lot of people like to bad mouth the 32/36 carb for having a flat spot or being hard to tune but its was what my rail came with when I inherited it. I had zero carb experience but I spent about six months reading everything I could about it and eventually got mine running very well. It really came down to understanding how this carb and the VW in general is not like other carbureted engines you commonly see and needs some special considerations to make it run well. its not hard to do, its just important to do it right.

When you pull the carb check to see what jets you have. Virtually every one of these carbs comes with the wrong jets, mine certainly did. It still ran but it was much improved with the right jets.

Mon Feb 08, 2016 5:03 pm

I'll post and let you know jet sizes and my findings

Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:05 am

Here is the best advice I can give on the progressive carbs. The belong on a Pinto, not a VW

Hey, you wanted advice right :lol:

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:24 pm

OK here's what happened... rebuilt carb with a kit. Cleaned throughly... now engine does stay running at idle... barely! Idle mixture and speed screws at baseline.. maybe speed screw 1/4 turn more than baseline to start.... anyways the instruction from vw resource says the engine will sound like a tractor but thats OK to start... anyways the idle mixture screw now does have an effect in decreasing or increasing engine speed... but is it still going to run like a tractor while trying to find the fastest idle with the mixture screw? I mean it sounds like it's heavily cammed at idle lol... is the idle speed screw supposed to smooth out the idle once it's raised to correct idle? Sorry if this is a confusing post.

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:41 pm

Adjust the idle mix screw until you reach the fastest idle, then back it off 1/4 turn.

THEN adjust the idle speed screw until the idle smooths out or you reach the desired RPMs (do you have a tach on this?) 8-900 RPMS.

You set the idle RPM to just barely run at first to make it easier to listen while you adjust the mix screw. The idea is that a properly set mix will give you the highest rpm in for that setting, not that your actually adjusting the rpm with the mix screw.

What size jets did you find BTW?

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:45 pm

I totally forgot to write it down.. I was too excited to assemble it all back together.. I can pull it off to verify the numbers with you though... OK so just to make it clear... while messing with the idle mixture.. the engine is not going to run smooth while listening for speed changes? Tach is coming Thursday along with 3 other gauges in the mail.

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:51 pm

Just so you know... I have the 009 mechanical advance... set at 10° btdc at idle... and it's advances to about 34? I want to put it at 7.5 at idle.. but man o man 10 is about the lowest I can go without the engine stalling at idle.

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:52 pm

Quote: OK so just to make it clear... while messing with the idle mixture.. the engine is not going to run smooth while listening for speed changes?

Thats correct, its still going to sound like a tractor, your just listening for the sweet spot where it runs the fastest (which will still be too slow to run smooth)

and then raise the speed with the idle speed screw until its smooth.

You also want to do this with a fully warmed up engine, spark gap, timing and valve adjustment must all be proper to begin with or your wasting your time messing with the idle screw.

Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:55 pm

We might have posted at the same time.. did you get my timing info the post before your last?

Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:03 pm

Desertstrike86 wrote: Just so you know... I have the 009 mechanical advance... set at 10° btdc at idle... and it's advances to about 34? I want to put it at 7.5 at idle.. but man o man 10 is about the lowest I can go without the engine stalling at idle.

Hmm, I've never had a problem with mine at 7.5 (I also have an 009) but it can vary from engine to engine and distributor to distributor. Maximum advance is more important than idle. It should be 28-30 at 3000 RPM.

If you haven't already I would start at the beginning. Adjust your valves, adjust your points, and then adjust your timing like this:

http://www.vw-resource.com/009_dizzy.html

Then tune your idle mix screw for best possible RPM at slow speed, and then turn up your idle speed until it runs smooth.

But if you have the wrong jets, no heat riser, etc your probably going to be doing it all again once you fix those things :)

Quote: We might have posted at the same time.. did you get my timing info the post before your last?

Yes...that seems to be happening :)

Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:07 pm

Hahaha... OK... I will start over just to be positive. Yep no heat risers... typical from what I have been seeing... I'm going to get a video together this week to show you what I am dealing with and all parts involved. Then you can hear my idle as well

Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:16 pm

Your going to struggle with no heat risers. Mine came without them either and and I could barely keep it running at first. The intake would get so cold I would actually have a pool of liquid gasoline in the T junction after a long idle, and then I would step on the gas and it would all get sucked into the engine and flood it. Even the cheap set up that just pulses exhaust gas back and forth is still a big improvement.

This is actually an interesting thread because it sounds like you are exactly where I was at two years ago. Luckily everything you need to know to get it running right is available online with a little searching, or asking.

Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:20 pm

Would I need heat risers in sun shiny arizona? I should titled this thread random newbie questions!